What Dental mill is considered best or capable,or what lab is using one mill for everything

[molarmaker]

New lab researching, will be primarily zirconia large cases, some occasion LD and there varients, and abutments.
Thanks

 

[Beatrice]

DMG, Roders, Mikron around $300 000+ each


Roland is awesome for Zirconia in a lab budget !

 

[Wainwright]

So, zirconia, lithium disilicate grinding, and titanium abutments?

A machine that does all of those well will be very expensive. I always recommend focusing on your primary application, like zirconia for example, starting there and add machines specifically for other applications as you get comfortable.

My reasoning is you can get a milling machine that is just dry, for zirconia, pretty affordably and it will be easy to run/maintain. Switching from milling, to grinding, to metal milling is a lot of work and you really can't cheap out.

5 axis Dry mill ~30k
Swiss army knife all materials mill ~100k

I hope this helps. Sorry I don't have any specific recommendations. Its been a few years since I've supported/sold/used milling machines and a lot has changed I'm sure!

 

[Wainwright]

DMG, Roders, Mikron around $300 000+ each


Roland is awesome for Zirconia in a lab budget !

Totally agree. My 100k for the swiss army knife mill is cheaping out! crazy

 

[CoolHandLuke]

Okuma, Kern, Tornos, Hermle, all way out of the pricepoint for dental, but all far more capable than any dental mill. though i'd be very tempted to get one of those 7 axis mill-turns for custom abutments

 

[Beatrice]

Okuma, Kern, Tornos, Hermle, all way out of the pricepoint for dental, but all far more capable than any dental mill. though i'd be very tempted to get one of those 7 axis mill-turns for custom abutments

You mean the 1 million dollars machine?

 

[CoolHandLuke]

Beatrice, we're in Canada, the shipping alone is 1 million.

 

[molarmaker]

Beatrice, we're in Canada, the shipping alone is 1 million.

This tread is turning out in a wrong direction

 

[Wainwright]

This tread is turning out in a wrong direction

Whats your budget : )

 

[Contraluz]

New lab researching, will be primarily zirconia large cases, some occasion LD and there varients, and abutments.
Thanks

If you are looking for a mill that does wet (LD) and dry (Zr),be aware there is quite a bit maintenance involved, when you change form wet to dry. You also need to define 'capable'. Most modern 5 axis mills are 'capable'. You kinda are looking for a 'Jack of all trades', but if you want to do LD grinding and Ti milling, you definitely want to look at a mill with a reinforced spindle. One that comes to my mind is the PM7 or the M4 form ZZ.

Another important factor: customer service. You may buy the most 'capable' mill but lousy customer service, which turns your milll into a 'very' heavy door step.

 

[zero_zero]

With this economic slowdown lightly used industrial cnc's are a dime a dozen

 

[Affinity]

Why dont you answer the question instead of fantasizing about lamborghinis. OP said new lab, not talking about what less than 1% of labs use to mill abutments. The 350i or the DOF sharp are the cheaper options if you dont want something chinese or used. Im sorry but to say you need a 100k mill to mill abutments is absurd. To suggest someone use a million dollar mill is laughable.

 

[Affinity]

BTW they are out there used, I just sold a 450i for around $10k. Even new they were only 50k.

 

[CoolHandLuke]

Why dont you answer the question instead of fantasizing about lamborghinis.

because its a ridiculous fantasy land idea as you well know by now.

one mill to do all that and be cheap - isn't going to be good.

if it was me i'd buy a wet mill for wet stuff and a dry mill for dry stuff and not mix them. because the big jobs take a long time to do, so you don't want to fill it up with small jobs or have a backlog.

when you split it up like that, theres a lot that can satisfy those criteria. a lot of cheap stuff.

 

[molarmaker]

If you are looking for a mill that does wet (LD) and dry (Zr),be aware there is quite a bit maintenance involved, when you change form wet to dry. You also need to define 'capable'. Most modern 5 axis mills are 'capable'. You kinda are looking for a 'Jack of all trades', but if you want to do LD grinding and Ti milling, you definitely want to look at a mill with a reinforced spindle. One that comes to my mind is the or the M4 form ZZ.

Another important factor: customer service. You may buy the most 'capable' mill but lousy customer service, which turns your milll into a 'very' heavy door step.

because its a ridiculous fantasy land idea as you well know by now.

one mill to do all that and be cheap - isn't going to be good.

if it was me i'd buy a wet mill for wet stuff and a dry mill for dry stuff and not mix them. because the big jobs take a long time to do, so you don't want to fill it up with small jobs or have a backlog.

when you split it up like that, theres a lot that can satisfy those criteria. a lot of cheap stuff.

I'm finding our the same thing, looking at zubler one for zirk glass and metal

 

[Affinity]

If a new lab is going to spend 100k on a new mill, they will have a bigger problem than worrying if the mill is 'good enough' they probably wont be able to pay for it. Different strokes I guess. Anyone with a startup, that would spend 100k on a mill in this business climate, with all the uncertainty, must be smarter, or wealthier than me. If money isnt an issue, then of course buy top of the line.
DOF sharp, while I wouldnt consider a 'good' mill, even DOF should admit that, does get the job done. And its less than half of 100k. Switching back and forth sucks, its not ideal and a pretty big waste of time, but for a new small lab, it pays the bills.

 

[Beatrice]

Why dont you answer the question instead of fantasizing about lamborghinis. OP said new lab, not talking about what less than 1% of labs use to mill abutments. The 350i or the DOF sharp are the cheaper options if you dont want something chinese or used. Im sorry but to say you need a 100k mill to mill abutments is absurd. To suggest someone use a million dollar mill is laughable.

Well yes Atlantis use 1 million dollars mill to do their abutment at their quality.
Second, milling abutment is really a bad idea if you don't use a proper machine but heh if you want to deliver bad solutions and product to your doc, your choice!

Milling ZIRCONIA is another questions, a nice small machine can do a lots in zirconia since precision is not a requirement with Zirconia, you will always use a TI base on implant or cement between your final crown and your abutment or bridge.

Milling TITANIUM is an ART and trust me, few know how to master it, many try and believe tho! You can go in school and take a 3 to 5 years class in college to learn how to run a 5 axis CNC and you believe that a dental tech lab could learn that on a forum on internet? No you can't, same as learning dental technique on internet, you can't, you have to take class and even the top tier dental tech in the industry continue to take class to stay on top

Not different in milling world!

I still think that a lab should get a nice Zirconia mill and outsource the titanium and Co-Cr to industrial manufacturer.

Oh and we didn't even discuss about spindle that break! $$$$$$ even on a low cost machine, sometime it cheaper to get a new mill than replacing the spindle!

So to answer the OP question, a nice Roland is really an awesome choice to start, easy to get a 2nd in case your machine have a problem and not stop your production.

My 2 cents

 

[RileyS]

New lab researching, will be primarily zirconia large cases, some occasion LD and there varients, and abutments.
Thanks

I can tell you who not to buy from. Terrible training, nice but not so good tech support, and a company with strange support strategy. PM me if interested. I'll not publicly name them

 

[Affinity]

This is like warren buffet telling me that only organic groceries will give me nutrition. There is no reason to believe that any mill on the general market wont mill a Ti preform, with certain exceptions of course. I agree that a new lab should outsource abutments maybe, but I dont know of any small start up labs, milling abutments to the interface. Perspective. And when no one but panthera or atlantis can mill a 'quality' abutment, then of course we should just obey! Who worries about profits in a startup anyway?
To the OP, milling a $35 preform, and selling it for $225 is one of the most profitable things a small lab can do, IMO. Dont believe the hype or the lecture on quality.

 

[DreN4do]

we are using the ivoclar PM5. but for an all around job, you might want to look into the ivoclar PM7.