New super trans zirconia

[hammerhead]

cool! What do you mean pics do not do justice?

One link above shows a piece 1mm thick and looks clear as glass to me? I feel justice has been served?

Definatly not seen this yet.

Looks like an eMax killer!

Glad I am buying more dry mills and already have an extra Two we have yet to plug-in.

I also heard someone say 3M Lava was going for a come-back with something new this year. ?? Anyone?

Lava Fantastic? Lava Awesome? LOL

A BIG lab on West Coast told me this 3M news late last week.

A lot of people wont understand clear and how to stain,trust me its way different. I too feel it will be a ecrack killer. Yes, next material from the 3"s will reset everything as we now know it.Told u about this Heany material a month ago Remember??????????/

 

[eyeloveteeth]

i know what he's talking about - it's the Fusion 600 zircnoia.

We have tried it, and do not like it. The gradient CAP ML looks better - especially in the mouth.

 

[Ken Knapp]

Transparent Zirconia:

http://www.tosoh.co.jp/technology/report/pdfs/2012_02_02.pdf
http://www.ikts.fraunhofer.de/content/dam/ikts/en/doc2/publications/annual-reports/jb2011/9_Transparent tetragonal zirconium oxide.pdf

Yes, transparent cubic zirconia with 10% Yttria has been around for a while. Tosoh has been playing around with different process methods for cubic zirconia to make it usable for non-hot isostatic process method.

Cubic zirconia is not phase transformation toughened like tetragonal zirconia with ~6% Yttria that is currently used by the dental industry and other medical applications.

The holy grail for transparent zirconia is transparent tetragonal zirconia, which is currently very difficult to achieve. Tetragonal zirconia is optically birefringent, anisotropic crystalline index of refraction. Cubic zirconia index of refraction is crystalline isotropic.

Birefringence causes light scattering in polycrystalline materials, like the dental zirconia.

Transparent tetragonal zirconia is a tough nut to crack.

I don't believe transparent cubic zirconia will make it to the dental market. Transparent tetragonal zirconia is coming.

Ken

 

[LA Ceramics]

Maybe we should ask Mark Jackson

This is a post from Oct of 2011

Seems like he ought to have found out something by now,...mmm

Mark Jackson

I have some pictures of an experimental zirconia that will be available in various levels of opacity, just like emax. The one marked A is the most translucent, and is 1mm thick.

I don't care what some milling centers say, they can't touch this with a ten foot pole, and the material IS NOT isostatically pressed. There are several new materials coming out, some fortified with exotic oxides. There are also some fortified LDS materials coming soon too.

I don't know if I'll even be able to get my hands on them when they do get here, but I've been lucky enough to see them.

http://www.pcdl.usa.com

 

[grantoz]

Yes I saw marks thread 2 years ago I think and was exited.its cool to think its actually coming out very soon as I saw an actuall flier from zirkonzahn.sorry cant resist even *** is interested after saying this thread has no point as its a fictitious material.

 

[thondaki]

Yes, transparent cubic zirconia with 10% Yttria has been around for a while. Tosoh has been playing around with different process methods for cubic zirconia to make it usable for non-hot isostatic process method.

Cubic zirconia is not phase transformation toughened like tetragonal zirconia with ~6% Yttria that is currently used by the dental industry and other medical applications.

The holy grail for transparent zirconia is transparent tetragonal zirconia, which is currently very difficult to achieve. Tetragonal zirconia is optically birefringent, anisotropic crystalline index of refraction. Cubic zirconia index of refraction is crystalline isotropic.

Birefringence causes light scattering in polycrystalline materials, like the dental zirconia.

Transparent tetragonal zirconia is a tough nut to crack.

I don't believe transparent cubic zirconia will make it to the dental market. Transparent tetragonal zirconia is coming.

Ken

Hey Ken , love the detailed explanations .. There is a 3ytzp that is totally clear .. I mean transparent and it fires a 1450 with the same properties for 3ytzp white , including toughness and strength .. It also has equivalent ageing properties...

 

[DMC]

So, where is this material?

Where is the hype in magazines?

How are Doctors suppose to be asking for this?

Still too early?

 

[eyeloveteeth]

So, where is this material?

Where is the hype in magazines?

How are Doctors suppose to be asking for this?

Still too early?

i wouldn't say too early. I would say a combination of bad marketing, and manufacturers finally understanding what the general populace wants.

Initially everyone was racing towards "indestructible" zirconia... but seriously who cares if it's 15000000000 mPa? It was a marketing gimmick by Jimmy and he did it real well because he was "first".

After that? Doctors have been mislead into thinking they want this super hard stuff that is nearly impossible to adjust in the mouth...so they then b!tch... and now we have crowns nearly 0.5mm out of occlusion...

where's the logic in that? none.



Finally, we are at a point in the industry where people are pulling their heads out of their a$$e$. Translucent Tosoh is nothing new...you just have to give up strength / hardness. Not to mention easier to produce (as long as it is isostatically pressed) - for example Zenostar is not isostatically pressed (hence the issues with possible warping on long spans).


Scott you haven't missed out on anything...if anything, you've just kept clear of the BS that goes on between manufacturers - resellers - and the lab.

We are using 16 shades of zirconia right now, and it is so much freaking better than shade range.

 

[Ken Knapp]

Hey Ken , love the detailed explanations .. There is a 3ytzp that is totally clear .. I mean transparent and it fires a 1450 with the same properties for 3ytzp white , including toughness and strength .. It also has equivalent ageing properties...

I have only seen transparent 3YTZP made by spark plasma sintering to date, more transparent in the red part of the spectrum. Based on the published materials research literature this is the best to date.

I would like to see examples of the material along with the composition and spectrophotometer data. I follow the published research literature an patents very closely.

Ken

 

[Ken Knapp]

Maybe we should ask Mark Jackson

This is a post from Oct of 2011

Seems like he ought to have found out something by now,...mmm

Mark Jackson

I have some pictures of an experimental zirconia that will be available in various levels of opacity, just like emax. The one marked A is the most translucent, and is 1mm thick.

I don't care what some milling centers say, they can't touch this with a ten foot pole, and the material IS NOT isostatically pressed. There are several new materials coming out, some fortified with exotic oxides. There are also some fortified LDS materials coming soon too.

I don't know if I'll even be able to get my hands on them when they do get here, but I've been lucky enough to see them.

http://www.pcdl.usa.com

I have seen samples similar to sample "A" with the current materials on the market. The other samples are very opaque compared to whats presently on the market. Depends on sintering parameters and coloring method. A 25 C final sintering temperature and heat rate and soak time makes a biGGG difference. The visual samples are a quick subjective look but can be misleading.
Comparison should be done with a spectrophotometer, which is objective and quantitative.

Ken

 

[DMC]

How many patients and doctors own a spectrophotometer! LOL

Most of us only care what our eyes can perceive see Ken.

Patient asks..."Why are my teeth not looking correct?"

Doc, "Oh, well the spectrophotometer says they are perfect." ?

Patient, "Ahhhh. What?".

 

[Ken Knapp]

How many patients and doctors own a spectrophotometer! LOL

Most of us only care what our eyes can perceive see Ken.

Patient asks..."Why are my teeth not looking correct?"

Doc, "Oh, well the spectrophotometer says they are perfect." ?

Patient, "Ahhhh. What?".

Yes, I understand. The final result is based on your eyes. However, quantitative optical measurement is the method to sort out samples when you are comparing samples with different shades, unshaded and unglazed like the disc samples posted.
Spectrophotometer explains what you are seeing and correlates with your eyes.

Example: How does a piece of clear glass look after you bead blast the surface, Opaque. Has the intrinsic material optical properties changed, No. A spectrophotometer measures transmission an reflection.

In materials development, when comparing material A to material B. A quantitative method is used to make an accurate comparison. In the end the final product, glazed and stained will "REFLECT" the quantitative measurements, so to speak.

Ken

 

[eyeloveteeth]

tl; dr

 

[Ken Knapp]

i know what he's talking about - it's the Fusion 600 zircnoia.

We have tried it, and do not like it. The gradient CAP ML looks better - especially in the mouth.

Just checked cleared FDA 510K and reviewed summaries for zirconia dental material. No FDA approval for "Fusion 600 zirconia" material or any zirconia with a different composition or lower strength of 600MPA.

I couldn't reach anyone at Esprit Dental about their Fusion 600 Zirconia material.

I would love to see this material.

Ken

 

[eyeloveteeth]

Just checked cleared FDA 510K and reviewed summaries for zirconia dental material. No FDA approval for "Fusion 600 zirconia" material or any zirconia with a different composition or lower strength of 600MPA.

I couldn't reach anyone at Esprit Dental about their Fusion 600 Zirconia material.

I would love to see this material.

Ken

I have no idea about this company - i tried to reach them too... but there is a reseller planning to sell this material. (sorry NDA)

 

[Ken Knapp]

I have no idea about this company - i tried to reach them too... but there is a reseller planning to sell this material. (sorry NDA)

When is the FDA clearance expected?

Ken

 

[eyeloveteeth]

When is the FDA clearance expected?

Ken

actually i'm so glad you looked that up. I have no idea when, and i HAD no idea it was not FDA cleared.

Now, the only way this could feasibly be sold is maybe it is a rebrand - in which case we have to find where it's coming from.

 

[rkm rdt]

the future of opposing dentition looks bleek. View attachment 16043

I see you figured out how to post pics.

.. still waiting....

 

[Ken Knapp]

I have no idea about this company - i tried to reach them too... but there is a reseller planning to sell this material. (sorry NDA)

About the FDA clearance for Fusion 600 zirconia. I would guess this product will have a difficult time getting clearance. The problem is that the existing predicate zirconia material clearances all have strengths greater than 900MPA and have an indications for use ranging from single units to long span posterior bridges.

A zirconia material with lower strength of 600MPA, although stronger than emax, will have a limited indications for use that will need to exclude posterior bridges and long span anterior bridges.

I would guess that the FDA will be concerned that this zirconia material could be mixed up with other types of zirconia and used for long span bridges and hence increased risk for failures.

This zirconia would have a different indications for use compared to all of the other zirconias on the market. Might be a problem for getting FDA clearance for a unique dental zirconia material.

Just my three cents.

Ken

 

[Ken Knapp]

actually i'm so glad you looked that up. I have no idea when, and i HAD no idea it was not FDA cleared.

Now, the only way this could feasibly be sold is maybe it is a rebrand - in which case we have to find where it's coming from.

I reviewed all of the zirconia materials cleared. None with reduced strength of 600MPA or unknown manufacturers.

Ken