AG Motion 2 For Dentures

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CanadaDenturist

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Hello. This is my first post here and just looking for some overall feedback.

I'm a denturist looking at getting into the world of digital dentures and the Amann Girrbach system appeals to me the most, mainly because of the fact that with the Motion 2 mill you can mill the basal and occlusal surfaces of Vita(and other) teeth using the DD Frame. To my knowledge AG is the only system in which you can do this. Or am I possibly missing something?

Since I'm a denturist and will only be using the mill for dentures and related products(milled implant substructures, partial frameworks etc) I don't want to get a mill where I don't have the ability to make single dentures against an opposing natural dentition. Making a single denture against an opposing dentition would require alteration of the occlusal surface of the teeth which I don't believe any other mills/systems can do at this time. Is this correct or are there any others that can mill the basal and occlusal surfaces of the teeth? Alternatively, does anyone know if the exclusivity of AG being able to mill the basal and occlusal surfaces of Vita teeth will be ending and will be available on other platforms in the future?

Does anybody here currently use the Motion 2 to mill both the denture base and teeth? If so, what are your thoughts of the results and process? Also, has your Motion 2 been consistantly reliable? I know AG sends out their own people to do repairs(apparently you have to pay their travel and accommodations as well) and the possible down time is a big consideration in my mind in going digital since they come from the US and I am in Canada. If you do have service needed to your mill how long is your typical down time?

I know there are much less expensive mills available which I could use to mill a denture base and use the Vita Vigo teeth, but then the mill can't alter the occlusal surface of the teeth. I know I could 3D print denture bases and teeth but I've never seen any great looking 3D printed dentures. I offer premium and high quality teeth and I feel using 3D printing would be taking a step backwards.

Your input is appreciated.
 
2thm8kr

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Even though you're from Canada I'll toss in a few thoughts. 😃
I'll add that I am not an acrylic/removable tech by any competent means so make sure you have a grain of salt handy.
If you want to use carded pre-manufactured teeth, AG was probably the first. I have seen some dentures made this way and they are as good or better than 'average' analog dentures.
The limit to this are the teeth available for this process. I'm sure there are more now, but several years ago there was only 2-3 companies. Typical pre-manufactured tooth molds are not consistent enough for a predictable digital work flow so you will want to use teeth made specifically for the digital process.
With generic exocad it is possible to make a single arch denture opposing a natural arch or other starting with Plovdiv CADApp version. This does not provide a 'turn key' solution for milling pre-manufactured teeth occlusal and basal sides using a holder similar to AG. That's not to say it couldn't be made to happen if you were the tinkering DIY type. If it is a patent protected process it may be coming to and end soon unless it were worth renewing/enforcing the protection. If it is an agreement between exocad and AG then who knows?? Right now there are a lot of prosthetic tooth libraries available in generic exocad. Several different branded manufacturers are represented. Some of these libraries are locked and by that I mean the teeth aren't scalable in size and the morphology can't readily be changed by moving a cusp tip or changing a buccal contour. Some or all of these libraries have cards available by the manufacturer. They could be put into a milled wax base and processed or possibly milled similar to the ones available in the AG version if a card stock holder was made or is available for the CAM software.
Many of the other libraries are unlocked and can be scaled, free formed, etc and milled like any other stl design file, occlusal and basal surfaces from your choice of materials.
My experience with milling dentures as temps for implant and other cases is pretty good for the most part. I don't use carded teeth and just mill the teeth from shaded multi layer PMMA and the base gingival shaded disks. For temporary solutions to what I'm solving and not having to get involved with a full blown acrylic lab set up. Not to mention my lack of practical experience with analog acrylic methods, it's been pretty solid.
Being able to print monolithic denture setups as prototype trials, scan appliances, custom trays, etc from the CAD designs and then mill amended two part designs is a huge plus.
My thoughts are AG will not have this process of milling carded teeth exclusively in perpetude, but they have been doing it longer, so the technical support and process should be pretty solid regarding that technique. I can't speak of their overall support since I've never dealt with them personally. I do have experience with proprietary and closed systems and will say that you will do it their way or you won't do it with that system. So keep that in mind! As you learn the process and start to think of solutions with digital tools, you may find a closed 'turn key' system to be very limiting in how you want to do it.
Branded versions of exocad have pluses and minuses, (read limitations) some more than others, not necessarily negative depending on your needs or how far you look down rabbit holes.
Be sure to ask every question you can think of regarding software design limitations or CAM process limitations from whichever company you decide to purchase from. Double check what they say as best as you can. Double check that the teeth you want to use are manufactured to specs compatible with the digital process.
Printed dentures are not there yet unless you're setting up a denture vending booth. Materials are lacking and not easily repairable.
Hopefully you find some useful info among all this yammering.
 
CoolHandLuke

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AG's denture thing is the Baltic system.

forget that nonsense. design your own.
 
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Ikon Dental

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Maybe printed to get all undercuts etc.?
 
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Ikon Dental

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life lol GIF by America's Funniest Home Videos
 
2thm8kr

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AG's denture thing is the Baltic system.

forget that nonsense. design your own.
They may have a system for Baltic dentures, but this is what the OP is referring to.
 

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