FRS vs. Valplast

[TheLabGuy]

I have two removable questions. What is the difference between FRS and Valplast? In addition, are their any limitations or requirements to Valplast? Like a traditional RPD needs certain undercuts and rests, does Valplast need rests as well? Okay that was three questions...... and hey give me a break here, I don't do Removable's but am very curious about it.

 

[DDDental]

Just fast answer.
FRS stands for Flexible Resin System and is made by Dentsply. Valplast is made by Valplast Corporation. Both are nylon based materials. FRS is more rigid and therefore less flexible and less resistant to breakage. As It is less flexible, it is more indicated for long free end cases with less undercut ( IMO I would never prescribe any of flexies for this one, but who asks me anyway). Valplast tends to flex itself together and therefore is not indicated for long shallow ridges.
Valplast where indicated is overall much better product, as it is practically unbreakable. FRS is easier to polish and looks better when polished and also has clear shade and Valplast does not. (Valplast has "clear" shade but is more white than clear.
Both are supposed to utilize tissue undercuts rather then tooth ones but it more depends on survey lines and aesthetics. (You can place clasps on posterior teeth only on tooth surface).

Rests are not necessary but could be used and require deeper rest seats.

Very hard to repair, should be not used in immediate cases. Plastic teeth are not chemically bonded to the base and teeth have to have mechanical retention .

Hope this helps.

 

[TheLabGuy]

Just fast answer.
FRS stands for Flexible Resin System and is made by Dentsply. Valplast is made by Valplast Corporation. Both are nylon based materials. FRS is more rigid and therefore less flexible and less resistant to breakage. As It is less flexible, it is more indicated for long free end cases with less undercut ( IMO I would never prescribe any of flexies for this one, but who asks me anyway). Valplast tends to flex itself together and therefore is not indicated for long shallow ridges.
Valplast where indicated is overall much better product, as it is practically unbreakable. FRS is easier to polish and looks better when polished and also has clear shade and Valplast does not. (Valplast has "clear" shade but is more white than clear.
Both are supposed to utilize tissue undercuts rather then tooth ones but it more depends on survey lines and aesthetics. (You can place clasps on posterior teeth only on tooth surface).

Rests are not necessary but could be used and require deeper rest seats.

Very hard to repair, should be not used in immediate cases. Plastic teeth are not chemically bonded to the base and teeth have to have mechanical retention .

Hope this helps.

Thanks a bunch, seriously, that was truly helpful. I know and understand the difference now. Thanks again

 

[CShof]

(You can place clasps on posterior teeth only on tooth surface).

Does this mean you clasp the tissue in the anterior region and the teeth themselves in the posterior region?

 

[DDDental]

Like I said " You can". It does not mean that it is always the case, but you can.
All depends again on the survey lines but, the top of the clasp on anteriors should finish on dentogingival margin. On Posteriors it could go more coronal as it is less of the aesthetic importance. Of coarse, we are talking about buccal clasps.

 

[sampson]

flexite vs valplast

hi all
How about flexite flexible dentures vs valplast
my info leads me to feel they are similar in material and finishing - however- processing / injecting are different.
Any body used either system?
thanks

 

[DDDental]

Flexite could not compete with Valplast for years. Finally they came out 5 years ago with a new formula Flexite Suprime and Flexite +. They are doomed. I believe they cover 5 % of flexible market nowadays. Valplast won,story finished. Flexite + has properties of Valplast, and Suprime of FRS, so everything mentioned about them before fits the bill. Nobilium came out with Nobilstar last year, and also there is TCS company trying to make it's way into the field. All in all, Valplast is the only one giving you lifetime warranty.
As for processing, there is absolutely no difference in processing any of them, other then melting temperature and time in an oven. Actually, now with all the conversion kits, you only need one processing unit to inject any of them.

 

[CYNOSURER]

Noblistar is Nobilium's premium metal for cast partials.

The flexible material is called:

Flex-Star V

I don't know if the 'V' is a Roman Numeral or a not-so-subliminal reference/association to Valplast.

 

[DDDental]

Noblistar is Nobilium's premium metal for cast partials.

The flexible material is called:

Flex-Star V

I don't know if the 'V' is a Roman Numeral or a not-so-subliminal reference/association to Valplast.

You are right.

 

[Kreyer]

In regards to Flexable RPD's such as Valplast etc... I do not make these in my lab and have stayed away because of advice from periodontists that I work with. The periodontists have told me of the recession they see due to the buccal/labial retentive extensions loading the gingival margins with vertical forces..

What are your thoughts on this problem if there is one. Should materials superceed biology?

Just some thoughts to throw into this discussion...

Rob

 

[DDDental]

In regards to Flexable RPD's such as Valplast etc... I do not make these in my lab and have stayed away because of advice from periodontists that I work with. The periodontists have told me of the recession they see due to the buccal/labial retentive extensions loading the gingival margins with vertical forces..

What are your thoughts on this problem if there is one. Should materials superceed biology?

Just some thoughts to throw into this discussion...

Rob

I agree Rob. Flexibles are just that, flexibles, and in my school long time ago, my teachers told us that major connector has to be ridged, they were even discussed with horse shoe design metal connector. Well, flexibles are here to stay no matter what you or I think about them. As for periodontal recession in patients wearing these kind of prosthesis, you are right, it is more likely to happen. But IMO all removables can be harmful if designed wrong. And unfortunately, they are designed wrong more often than right.

 

[Kreyer]

I agree Rob. Flexibles are just that, flexibles, and in my school long time ago, my teachers told us that major connector has to be ridged, they were even discussed with horse shoe design metal connector. Well, flexibles are here to stay no matter what you or I think about them. As for periodontal recession in patients wearing these kind of prosthesis, you are right, it is more likely to happen. But IMO all removables can be harmful if designed wrong. And unfortunately, they are designed wrong more often than right.

Thank you for your response!! You are so right that they are here to stay..

As you said cast rpd's can create harm if designed wrong..

This is soooo true....

 

[CPLZ]

We are not, as has been constantly repeated by the ADA, the responsible parties when it comes to prescribing treatment. I'm a business man, and if my customers, the responsible parties, want me to make rubber band and yarn prosthetics, then I'm a fool if I don't look into the feasibility of providing them.

I may decide not to enter that particular market, but nowhere in the decision process will be what my undervalued opinion on merit of the prosthetic is.

JMHO

 

[Denturist]

In regards to Flexable RPD's such as Valplast etc... I do not make these in my lab and have stayed away because of advice from periodontists that I work with. The periodontists have told me of the recession they see due to the buccal/labial retentive extensions loading the gingival margins with vertical forces..

What are your thoughts on this problem if there is one. Should materials superceed biology?

Just some thoughts to throw into this discussion...

Rob

All in all I agree with you. I do not offer flexibles, however with that said I do not mean they are totally without merit, there are limited applications where they do better than cast PDs.
However that can be said about everything, each case has to be evaluated for the most appropriate solution.
The problem is that everybody is in a rush and the time it takes to evaluate the case just eats into the profit margin, this is NOT good dentistry

Hope that makes sense.... I'm only on my 4th cup of coffee.....

 

[Kreyer]

We are not, as has been constantly repeated by the ADA, the responsible parties when it comes to prescribing treatment. I'm a business man, and if my customers, the responsible parties, want me to make rubber band and yarn prosthetics, then I'm a fool if I don't look into the feasibility of providing them.

I may decide not to enter that particular market, but nowhere in the decision process will be what my undervalued opinion on merit of the prosthetic is.

JMHO

My business model is guided by morals and ethical practices not the ADA.....

As stated above we all make personal decisions on which prosthetic products to include in our line...

Robert Kreyer CDT

 

[CPLZ]

My business model is guided by morals and ethical practices

That goes without saying. Everyones business model is guided by morals and ethical practices. Thing is, there is no one set of morals, and ethics never have been black and white, they are an excuse to slide a scale to a begin and end point that justifies the users position. One of histories great lessons is that ethics is a word only, the concept is fallacy because there can't be a ubiquitous standard.

 

[kcdt]

Don't make. When a potential client asks, I tell them they are temporaries without the ability to reline or repair (yes, I am aware that valplast has a repair protocol) in a manner that's simple compared to working with PMMA. My take is that the client who asks for these first as opposed to a definitve treatment is not a client I'm looking to keep over the long haul. I want Drs looking to master removable prosthodontics, and if that's not their journey, eventually our paths will diverge.

 

[Flipperlady]

Don't make. When a potential client asks, I tell them they are temporaries without the ability to reline or repair (yes, I am aware that valplast has a repair protocol) in a manner that's simple compared to working with PMMA. My take is that the client who asks for these first as opposed to a definitve treatment is not a client I'm looking to keep over the long haul. I want Drs looking to master removable prosthodontics, and if that's not their journey, eventually our paths will diverge.

I did a couple of Astron Ultraflex awhile back to see how they did long term
before i start doing them on a regular basis. One has come back that "literally" fell apart. This is what I heard from dentists assistant way after the fact so i never got to see it (not sure how bad it really was). i had invoiced it as a temp. I've sent out a few Valplast and dentist had to do a
lot of adjusting to get comfortable (actually he sent it back to me to adjust).
Polishing and adjusting wasn't hard but my experience with working with Valplast was that it would make a great? temp. I know there are those who swear by them but it just doesn't seem like something i'd want to wear.

Michelle

 

[CYNOSURER]

I can't really get into the Valplast good or bad argument. Seems all the 'evidence' for "Valplast good" comes from docs who use it.
And all the evidence for "Valplast bad" comes from docs who have tried it a few times or not at all. Unfortunately, as with all removables, there are so many variables that can cause failure that it is too hard to pin the 'failure' of any Valplast on the flexible concept. On the other hand, Valplast Corp has some great anecdotal (for lack of a better word) evidence that flexibles are quite beneficial. Their great lament is that in the early sixties the VA was in the middle of some great studies on the stuff when a little thing called Vietnam put it all on hold. I do know that the success of a flexible partial is strongly tied to occlusion in that poor occlusion will have a more immediate effect on a flexible than on a rigid. The resulting initial pain or discomfort will result in patient rejection whereas a rigid tooth borne appliance can tolerate poor occlusion as the abutment prevents the pain by simply absorbing the inappropriate stresses and becoming what they've always been assumed to be...slow extractors.

 

[Flipperlady]

I can't really get into the Valplast good or bad argument. Seems all the 'evidence' for "Valplast good" comes from docs who use it.
And all the evidence for "Valplast bad" comes from docs who have tried it a few times or not at all. Unfortunately, as with all removables, there are so many variables that can cause failure that it is too hard to pin the 'failure' of any Valplast on the flexible concept. On the other hand, Valplast Corp has some great anecdotal (for lack of a better word) evidence that flexibles are quite beneficial. Their great lament is that in the early sixties the VA was in the middle of some great studies on the stuff when a little thing called Vietnam put it all on hold. I do know that the success of a flexible partial is strongly tied to occlusion in that poor occlusion will have a more immediate effect on a flexible than on a rigid. The resulting initial pain or discomfort will result in patient rejection whereas a rigid tooth borne appliance can tolerate poor occlusion as the abutment prevents the pain by simply absorbing the inappropriate stresses and becoming what they've always been assumed to be...slow extractors.

It's hard for me to judge Valplast just yet because of the variables. I outsourced to a place that rhymes with wide-bell. The first one I had to send back because all of the flexible clasps broke off when I tried it on the master models to inspect before I sent off to dentist. The second one was an upper/lower valpast processed on metal framework. Dentist sent back to adjust three times to make thinner and adjust under clasp because it was so tight tissue was bleeding. Hot water soak did not help in this case.
I am really wanting to like flexibles, but seems I'm am have a string of bad luck getting started. However like a pitbull dog it would seem i once I make my mind up I generally see these things through. One thing I have learned is to forget about all the pseudo flexible materials out there ie... Ultraflex etc....
and concentrate on a better product. I want to check out a Flexite partial
and will check in on that later.

michelle