Creation Zi CT

[Car 54]

excuse me for my question i d'ont understand the expression backed with dentine and i added some g7 ?

As far as when I said it, backed up, in it being a "canvas" to layer his Inc on. Like a D4, low value, to cover the zi frame and create a backstop to the Inc edge (as Drizzt mentioned) to work on top of. Maybe even like mixing D4 with SI-06 1:1, to help with translucency and lower the value from underneath?

 

[D1X06]

As far as when I said it, backed up, in it being a "canvas" to layer his Inc on. Like a D4, low value, to cover the zi frame and create a backstop to the Inc edge (as Drizzt mentioned) to work on top of. Maybe even like mixing D4 with SI-06 1:1, to help with translucency and lower the value from underneath?

now i understand your explication (car 54 and drizzt) it is very sympatic from your part to answer and explain - a lot of thank you- sometimes i d'ont understand very well english and i repeat my felicitation for your works and respect to achieve this level in your layering technique

 

[Drizzt]

now i understand your explication (car 54 and drizzt) it is very sympatic from your part to answer and explain - a lot of thank you- sometimes i d'ont understand very well english and i repeat my felicitation for your works and respect to achieve this level in your layering technique

Thank you Patrick for your kind words. I am happy to help you if I can

 

[Car 54]

now i understand your explication (car 54 and drizzt) it is very sympatic from your part to answer and explain - a lot of thank you- sometimes i d'ont understand very well english and i repeat my felicitation for your works and respect to achieve this level in your layering technique

No problem, patrick, and you're welcome Different languages and word meaning can be a little confusing, so ask anytime for clarification when needed, glad to help

 

[D1X06]

No problem, patrick, and you're welcome Different languages and word meaning can be a little confusing, so ask anytime for clarification when needed, glad to help

very nice

 

[D1X06]

very nice

are you using special firing program for creation (i know each furnace with his temperature is not equal ) but for example the holding time - i bake some creation dentin programs with just 10sec hold time

 

[Car 54]

are you using special firing program for creation (i know each furnace with his temperature is not equal ) but for example the holding time - i bake some creation dentin programs with just 10sec hold time

Hopefully Drizzt will reply to your question, too. I'm at 45 sec hold, and just lower my high temp if it's a smaller bake, but still at 45 seconds. I use ZI-F for emax and zi.

 

[D1X06]

Hopefully Drizzt will reply to your question, too. I'm at 45 sec hold, and just lower my high temp if it's a smaller bake, but still at 45 seconds. I use ZI-F for emax and zi.

i used ZI-Fsome years ago and since ZI-CT comes out i use it - i love ZI-CT- for greater bake i although have longer hold time and higher temp- my furnaces are dekema

 

[Car 54]

i used ZI-Fsome years ago and since ZI-CT comes out i use it - i love ZI-CT- for greater bake i although have longer hold time and higher temp- my furnaces are dekema

I would probably also use the CT for it's slight improvement(s) over ZI-F, but since I can use ZI-Fs lower firing temp on emax and zirconia, it helps to get the same look when doing those metal free type of cases. I use a Unitek Ultra Mat CDF (lol...It's still running) for minor things like some opaques, most of my InSync glazes.
Otherwise, I have a Dekema 3001 which has been a workhorse. I've only had to replace 1 heating relay, and 1 muffle since I've owned it, about 15 years.

 

[D1X06]

I would probably also use the CT for it's slight improvement(s) over ZI-F, but since I can use ZI-Fs lower firing temp on emax and zirconia, it helps to get the same look when doing those metal free type of cases. I use a Unitek Ultra Mat CDF (lol...It's still running) for minor things like some opaques, most of my InSync glazes.
Otherwise, I have a Dekema 3001 which has been a workhorse. I've only had to replace 1 heating relay, and 1 muffle since I've owned it, about 15 years.

i have a dekema M since 23years like you only one heating relay and one muffle changing- dekema is very good quality -long life -i use it only for metal ceramique-8years ago i bought a dekema D4 AND USE IT ONLY FOR ALL CERAMIC FRAMEWORKS no metal frameworks and now for my old days i bought a dekema 624 oral design- though the furnace is oraldesign and the man behind will try to become oraldesign but this is a other story!

 

[D1X06]

i have a dekema M since 23years like you only one heating relay and one muffle changing- dekema is very good quality -long life -i use it only for metal ceramique-8years ago i bought a dekema D4 AND USE IT ONLY FOR ALL CERAMIC FRAMEWORKS no metal frameworks and now for my old days i bought a dekema 624 oral design- though the furnace is oraldesign and the man behind will try to become oraldesign but this is a other story!

precision i d'ont want to become oraldesign and never will be it - i try to make teeth and not crowns

 

[Drizzt]

Hey everyone, this is a all on 6 screw retained zirconia bridge. 6 anterior layered with Creation ZiCT, 6 posterior is stained and glazed with Ivocolor

 

[D1X06]

Hey everyone, this is a all on 6 screw retained zirconia bridge. 6 anterior layered with Creation ZiCT, 6 posterior is stained and glazed with Ivocolor

great work you are an artist with creation ct the 6 posterior are full zircon?
you are milling in-house ?and have you a picture of occlusal view in order to see the junction between elements - my clients are angry with great bridge in zirconia
they think it will broken it' not strong enough

 

[CoolHandLuke]

great work you are an artist with creation ct the 6 posterior are full zircon?
you are milling in-house ?and have you a picture of occlusal view in order to see the junction between elements - my clients are angry with great bridge in zirconia
they think it will broken it' not strong enough

you can demonstrate with mathematics how silly that idea is.

the strength of zirconia is huge, it is the strongest material we have used in dental, ever. in a cross section, square-milimeter for square-milimeter it is not only higher than any other material for flexural and compressive strength, it is so at every dimension. that is to say increasing the cross sectional area increases strength in a non linear fashion.

there is a cross sectional area at which no amount of human force can be exerted to break the piece. you have to drop it off a building to see it crack let alone break.

cross sectionally, the connector strength can be so strong that the human bones will break before the zirconia will break.

on a piece like drizzt showed in the recent photo, if that was solid zirconia, it would take upwards of 6000 N of force in any area to begin exerting force enough to cause a crack. this is 600 kg of force in a single point.

if it breaks, the patient - without exception - got into a fight with a car. if not, someone's been grinding on it.

 

[JMN]

you can demonstrate with mathematics how silly that idea is.

the strength of zirconia is huge, it is the strongest material we have used in dental, ever. in a cross section, square-milimeter for square-milimeter it is not only higher than any other material for flexural and compressive strength, it is so at every dimension. that is to say increasing the cross sectional area increases strength in a non linear fashion.

there is a cross sectional area at which no amount of human force can be exerted to break the piece. you have to drop it off a building to see it crack let alone break.

cross sectionally, the connector strength can be so strong that the human bones will break before the zirconia will break.

on a piece like drizzt showed in the recent photo, if that was solid zirconia, it would take upwards of 6000 N of force in any area to begin exerting force enough to cause a crack. this is 600 kg of force in a single point.

if it breaks, the patient - without exception - got into a fight with a car. if not, someone's been grinding on it.

Had one get into a fight with a I-Beam. Lost tooth, implant, and chunk of bone when it cantilevered out.

 

[D1X06]

you can demonstrate with mathematics how silly that idea is.

the strength of zirconia is huge, it is the strongest material we have used in dental, ever. in a cross section, square-milimeter for square-milimeter it is not only higher than any other material for flexural and compressive strength, it is so at every dimension. that is to say increasing the cross sectional area increases strength in a non linear fashion.

there is a cross sectional area at which no amount of human force can be exerted to break the piece. you have to drop it off a building to see it crack let alone break.

cross sectionally, the connector strength can be so strong that the human bones will break before the zirconia will break.

on a piece like drizzt showed in the recent photo, if that was solid zirconia, it would take upwards of 6000 N of force in any area to begin exerting force enough to cause a crack. this is 600 kg of force in a single point.

if it breaks, the patient - without exception - got into a fight with a car. if not, someone's been grinding on it.

very informatif in the software of the scanner i have to respect the parameter of the surface of the connector between the elements of the bridge it's big surface and sometimes its difficult to manage this to have good separation to have a good look that all teeth of the bridge seems single elements
the piece driezzt showed is very esthetic teeth look separate s
it's why i ask him to have a look occlusal how he manage the junction between the teeth he have o lot of experience and make big cases very well

 

[Drizzt]

Thanks for the kind words !

Hey Luke ! From my experience, everything breaks. Nobody can guarantee that a material will stay forever intact in such a complex environment as the oral cavity and the masticatory system. Too many variables that can't be calculated 100%. Something strength is not enough , we also need some flexibility or some shock absorbing properties. Case selection is the key IMO.

D1X06, ''Prettau' kind of bridges are not simple to make and look good. We can make them look separated and still respect the material's properties regarding strength. Yes I am milling in-house everything. I am not an artist with Creation, I still have a lot to learn! Yes 6 posterior are full contour and just stained. I will have the patient in the lab for photos, i will try to shoot some occlusal pics.

 

[CoolHandLuke]

Thanks for the kind words !

Hey Luke ! From my experience, everything breaks. Nobody can guarantee that a material will stay forever intact in such a complex environment as the oral cavity and the masticatory system. Too many variables that can't be calculated 100%. Something strength is not enough , we also need some flexibility or some shock absorbing properties. Case selection is the key IMO.

D1X06, ''Prettau' kind of bridges are not simple to make and look good. We can make them look separated and still respect the material's properties regarding strength. Yes I am milling in-house everything. I am not an artist with Creation, I still have a lot to learn! Yes 6 posterior are full contour and just stained. I will have the patient in the lab for photos, i will try to shoot some occlusal pics.

precisely.

you want to control the method and mode of failure to be the least detrimental to the patient. this is what makes flexible materials better, because this control can be acheived with planning and with science. knowing proper masticatory movements and designing a case that you can know for sure what happens at 200 000 cycles.

 

[D1X06]

Thanks for the kind words !

Hey Luke ! From my experience, everything breaks. Nobody can guarantee that a material will stay forever intact in such a complex environment as the oral cavity and the masticatory system. Too many variables that can't be calculated 100%. Something strength is not enough , we also need some flexibility or some shock absorbing properties. Case selection is the key IMO.

D1X06, ''Prettau' kind of bridges are not simple to make and look good. We can make them look separated and still respect the material's properties regarding strength. Yes I am milling in-house everything. I am not an artist with Creation, I still have a lot to learn! Yes 6 posterior are full contour and just stained. I will have the patient in the lab for photos, i will try to shoot some occlusal pics.

hey drizzt
what kind of zirconia is it?

 

[D1X06]

hey drizzt
what kind of zirconia is it?

a other question
you are working alone and what's the percentage between all ceramic and metal ceramic in your lab?