Sagemax zirconia

[RileyS]

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I've been feeling extremely stupid all week and this confirms it.

 

[Ron.Ferland]

Interesting.

 

[Ron.Ferland]

When a laboratory makes the choice to use the cheapest product available, usually believing that “it’s all the same” they are taking on risk. This FDA warning to Sagemax identifies the risk associated with that product in particular. Is it worth it? Do a laboratory’s customers know that they are taking a risk too? NO. Watch out all the vendors that Sagemax private labels, like Argen. They're in the same boat.

 

[Affinity]

Sorry but since when does the federal government declare whether a product is "good' or not .. especially based on the filing of paperwork and procedures.. So a different product, of inferior quality, made in china, or wherever else in the world, gets a pass because they file their paperwork properly? I understand the need for testing the zirconia, but correct me if im wrong, the FDA only makes determinations on reports from the company itself.. they dont do their own testing! So what we should be saying is.. Sagemax tests their zirconia to be to the highest standard, but because they didnt document it correctly , the way the Feds deem proper.. then the product and their testing is garbage?

Who declares the quality of a product? The FDA or the consumer?

Im sure SM will be along to clear things up when they get their ducks in a row, But, I use this product and I like it.. and I like that is made in the US.. and I like that its affordable.. Thats enough for me.

 

[eyeloveteeth]

nothing here is inferring that the product is inferior in anyway. We have used Sagemax products for a very long time with wonderful results.

if you look at the things the FDA is nit picking at, it's all logistic stuff in the background for the most part. To me, it just sounds like they pissed off the wrong auditor and got written up.

Go check out any other manufacturer's audits, there's at least 1 a year from the other big lab companies. What really stuck out this time was that the FDA auditor decided to just go on a rampage.


Seems rigged to me

 

[Radu]

Same here. We are very satisfied with Sagemax. Fantastic product and consistent results. Don't know what's with FDA but I'm sick of bureaucracy..

 

[Ron.Ferland]

ly

Sorry but since when does the federal government declare whether a product is "good' or not .. especially based on the filing of paperwork and procedures.. So a different product, of inferior quality, made in china, or wherever else in the world, gets a pass because they file their paperwork properly? I understand the need for testing the zirconia, but correct me if im wrong, the FDA only makes determinations on reports from the company itself.. they dont do their own testing! So what we should be saying is.. Sagemax tests their zirconia to be to the highest standard, but because they didnt document it correctly , the way the Feds deem proper.. then the product and their testing is garbage?

Who declares the quality of a product? The FDA or the consumer?

Im sure SM will be along to clear things up when they get their ducks in a row, But, I use this product and I like it.. and I like that is made in the US.. and I like that its affordable.. Thats enough for me.

The point is you get what you pay for. Sagemax may work well in your hands today, but if there skimping on the basics to keep the FDA happy, what else are they skimping on? You really do have to ask this basic question: How exactly can SM sell their stuff for so little? Especially noting that the materials are made in the USA, with US taxes and high manpower costs. Most of us here are owners of labs. How do we go about selling our products lower than anyone else? 1. Outsource to China, Vietnam, and/or India and the like. 2. Use lower priced raw materials. 3. Employee low cost manpower. 4. Skip protocol to get things out the door as cheap as possible. So again. How do they sell their stuff so cheaply?

 

[PJR]

Maybe it doesn't really cost that much to make zirconia? Have you ever made zirconia before?

 

[Ron.Ferland]

Maybe it doesn't really cost that much to make zirconia? Have you ever made zirconia before?

Before? Before what?

I have not produced a zirconia disc from raw materials. I do run a business though and understand sourcing raw materials for the products I produce. I understand I can save money by cutting corners. This is what is happening with SM, or they are just very unlucky with the FDA.

Frankly, I want to use products from companies that have been around for a while, you know? DePuy Zr implants were good, until they weren't. I can't afford to have no backup when problems arise. JMHO though.

 

[NicelyMKV]

Ron, I was buying zenostar for less than Sagemax. You obviously have some tie to Ivoclar so explain how Ivoclar can sell it so cheap?

 

[Ron.Ferland]

Ron, I was buying zenostar for less than Sagemax. You obviously have some tie to Ivoclar so explain how Ivoclar can sell it so cheap?

How the heck are/were you buying Zenostar for less than Sage? What are you using now?

No tie to ivoclar except I buy their stuff and feel they are the only guys really helping me grow my business. Maybe I'm native, but this means something.

 

[Tom Moore]

A company with market share and profits will clear this up asap. That is what FDA wants....compliance. The FDA registers products and manufactures and make sure they are keeping the paperwork on their manufacturing they are supposed to keep. I Do find it strange that most labs that do not don't follow the FDA rules have so much to say about this.

 

[sidesh0wb0b]

folks, did you read the report? as I stated above a few times....these look to be nothing more than procedural items. NOT the zi itself, but filing of paperwork.
and if we are all super honest with each other we know that the government has the best filing system on the planet. they always have everything in proper order and never lose files. or emails, or hard drives....

the simple facts remain, sagemax produces a product that is of nice quality and made in the US. many many many people enjoy and prefer their zirconia. I am willing to bet SM will get everything fixed up to meet the FDA requirements and business will continue as normal.

 

[NicelyMKV]

How the heck are/were you buying Zenostar for less than Sage? What are you using now?

No tie to ivoclar except I buy their stuff and feel they are the only guys really helping me grow my business. Maybe I'm native, but this means something.

.... Ivoclar was giving me a great price or Sagemax isn't.... You have me wondering now Ron...lol

 

[PJR]

I think both Ivoclar and sagemax have great products. Ivoclars zirconia may be priced higher because they have a bigger marketing campaign. Sagemax doesn't cut corners they just don't market as much. This may be the difference in price

 

[Tom Moore]

When you deal with people that operate in a paper world a lie on paper will sometimes look better that the truth coming out of your mouth.

 

[ts4341]

Use Talladium!