Roland DWX 50 Vs. Wieland Zenotec Mini

[j.abadsantos]

80-100

 

[BobCDT]

500-700 from diamond coated tools. Much more bang for the buck.

 

[AGV]

carbide: 100 units / + - 60 Euros
Diamond: 300 units / + - 95 Euros

 

[Sevan P]

It all comes down to the the strategy, feedrate, and RPM. Slower on both= Longer bur life Faster= shorter. For a period of time I was getting on the 2mm burs for the Roland Carbide from Talladium 125-160 on the 2mm and upwards of 180-200 on the 1mm and the .6mm hell cut thousands on end before i felt sorry for the bur and changed it out. LOL. But now something must of changed cause me old boss tells me no more the 80-90 units.

But he is testing out a new set of burs I think carbide and as of last week hundred on both burs and it still was cutting. I was there while we cut about 6 FC on day flawless. But Diamonds or a sure bang for the buck once you get the strategy dialed in right. Sierra has some really good ones ZRo2 as well and then obviously Roland has there own.

 

[sevlow]

Has anybody used the Wieland Select ? I've heard there are 100 going to the USA shortly !!

 

[MDTECH]

Mini:
Screw drive (very accurate)
Jäger spindle, (air driven more torque)
Electronic touch off (more accurate but a pain in the ARSE as well)
4 Axis
Comes with a basic CNC controller and cam software, very user friendly, fast and a no brainer.
Good suction Design

Roland DWX-50
Belt drive axis (not screw driven, less accurate)
Belt Drive Spindle (not air Driven less torque)
5 Axis
Vpanel to auto start Cams
No Cam software Optioanl 3rd party is needed (sum3D, Work NC, DelCam)
decent suction Design

Both around the same price range, mini is a tad more. Both will get the job done. Both are great machines. Depend on what you are going for, simple crown and bridge or preateau style full arches.

As Bob from CAP would say "5 Axis and never look back."

Roland you can use ANY tools you want, sierra, Zro2 etc anything with a 4mm shaft,. Mini you are very very limited to tolls able to be used due to the electronic touch off system. Other will chine in with other tings I might of left off.

Hope this helps

Sevan

Almost Perfect Answer, the roland is accurate also and the big + is the sum 3d but very price.

My experience: wet and dry milling = good marketing and easy to sell no more - but use to every day? Yes, a few months, after 3-4 months problems, problems, problems every day

good luck

 

[MDTECH]

Wieland Select or the Impression S5 wet option, mechanical touch off no more electronics and crashing of burs due to ZR dust interference. 16 tool holder auto disk changer CadBlu said they have it in testing and it is priced around $44k Looks like a promising little mill CrCo not sure about Ti. But glass for sure depending on CAM Software.

CadBlue - hahaha. Not fair at all

 

[primus]

??? Go to here and introduce yourself. http://dentallabnetwork.com/forums/forums/introduce-yourself.30/

Welcome to the forum! Your are in Maryland?? Or MD stands for Master-Tech or something??

You think the Roland is accurate? Do you own any real measuring equipment to have a reason to say this, or just pulling out info from your a55 based on feelings and your eyes only?

It is the worst CNC mill on the market! Only a simple home switch. No real encoders for live feed-back for positioning accuracy. There is no frame! LOL Just an empty box with a couple poles that suspend a Micky-Mouse spindle.....bouncing around and flopping. LOL No ball-screws, no real CNC rail system with accurate bearing-blocks. Run by rubber belts and has no brains at all.

 

[BobCDT]

Carbide tools get 60-80 units a set.

 

[Sevan P]

Carbide tools get 60-80 units a set.

LOL Bob, very Random.

 

[Sevan P]

Almost Perfect Answer, the roland is accurate also and the big + is the sum 3d but very price.

Side by side DWX-50 and iMes 340i iMes had a better result. Margin line offset set at .2 same crown cut on both machines Roland left a visibly larger margin line then the iMes 340i, both were camed with sum3D. Screw driven gave the more precise measurement then belt. Don't get me wrong the Roland DWX-50 is a great machine but when it comes down to accuracy other machines have it beat hands down, maybe even the VHF 4axis on your basic milling stuff, copings, frames and crowns with out the technical undercuts and continuous 5th axis needs.

 

[cadfan]

first of all with any margin line offset at .2 these are 20 my this is like using two ore three times spacer over the margin would any technician outside do this on a normal framework
and talking after that about precision ??? I dont think any 3 shape margin is as accurate to give a real information its just a feeling not more.Make a secondary telescope but not a simple coping with such offset ore a split file abutment and crown try this until you have the right spacer for each machine they could be different and than try to repeat it five ore ten times.

 

[MoonShaun]

So these diamond burs 300 units, or 500-700 units really? i have been getting close to a 100 on a set with no problem on my carbide for the mini. Here is my question, is the finish going to be just as smooth with the diamond ones? I know that we outsourced our milling before we got the mini and the quality of the crowns were not near as good as the ones that we are milling. A couple places had great margins but the rest of the crown still showed all the milling marks all the way around, therefore taking more time for finishing or a heavier glaze, I never did ask what burs they were using. Needless to say after milling in lab we were very impressed with our mill. What burs would you all suggest on trying out, because getting 3-7 times more units for the life of the burs is a no brainer but only if the finish is the same or better imo!

 

[cadfan]

Why your talking always how big how long the mill is faster better than every technician and what are the cost for Technician i bye a bur for 25-30 dollar so if i get 60 parts 1 dollar per unit what a joke . There is no non diamond coated bur outside getting 3-7 times more although some coated are bull.... it depends always on your camsoftware ax limitation ,strategie and material and at least on your eyes whats quality for you so don't be impressed milling centers use sometimes fast strategies . I talked to a bur manufacturer about his non coated burs he says some guys where very impressed using them 50 hours on a mini so he knows how to handle this info he says 5 hours i said ten after changing my software i was back by 5-6 hours starting marginal out brakes depending on the used material.

 

[shane williams]

I am sure that you guys have already talked about this somewhere on this thread before. I am new here and new to the milling aspect of lab work. I have heard a lot of great things about the DWX 50 and a few good things about the Mini. I just have not read a lot of reviews on the Mini, I am very interest in both and wanting to see what you guys think. Any help would be greatly appreciated, Looking at biting the bullet in the next month or so and picking one up. We currently our using 3 Shape and outsourcing our milling.
Shaun

First off, welcome to DLN. You'll find a lot of your questions can be answered here. Here we also have 3Shape, been using it for around 4 years. We love it. We paired it up with 2 Roland DWX-50. Have milled thousands of zr crowns, and haven't had any fit issue, margin problems. We also use SUM3D, and use diamond coated burs from Zr02. Getting around 300 units a set before I notice chipping.

 

[AdrianB]

Hello.

I have a Wieland Mini for about a year and a half. In that time I milled about 9000 pieces in wax/zirconia/pmma and never had any problems.
95% of my jobs do not need 5-axis.

I do not know how is the Roland but the Mini is being just perfect.

Adolfo, how is the Mini doing? Do you still have it. Is it with basic cam? I am thinking to get one from Ivoclar. Is it worth it? You should have it now for 3 yrs. Any issues with the spindle. Adrian.

 

[Adolfo]

I care a lot to the machine. I have not had any problem in all this time. Also I have a VHF CAM4K4 and cam software is better but the machine is the same. To work in 3 axes is perfect . I recommend it.

 

[AdrianB]

I care a lot to the machine. I have not had any problem in all this time. Also I have a VHF CAM4K4 and cam software is better but the machine is the same. To work in 3 axes is perfect . I recommend it.

Where did you get the mini from.

 

[Adolfo]

Wieland Spain. (Now is Ivoclar....)