New Triple Tray system ??

[ChrisR]

What kind of triple tray systems are everybody using?? Right now i am using the twin trays from dental ventures but they seem to be a bit of a pain. I want to stay with the pinless system if i can find a good one. Anybody have one thay they like ?

 

[TheLabGuy]

Sorry, I use pins......Artimax, plastic base articulators, nice.

 

[ChrisR]

DO you find it easy to line up the pins w/ the preps ? and are the hinges fixed on the bases? or do you gotta glue them.

 

[TheLabGuy]

yeah, lining up the pins with the preps/adjacent teeth isn't bad at all, it's a very clean and VERY accurate system, very little stone used, therefore not much distortion from stone shrink rates. As for the hinges, no gluing, they are also made out of hard plastic but you can interchange max, and mand if need be. I like it, best system I have found in awhile, I was apprehensive at first, but it worked for me, let me find you the site........here you go. Artimax Products
Advantages......VERY CLEAN and accurate system, contacts are usually right on in the patients mouth.
Disadvantages......Some cases you will still have to mount traditionally with a front pin articulator, especially the cases that involve large edentulous spaces.

However, for the average, nuts and bolt case, this system is the best i've found, if someone knows of something better, let me know, I'm always open to new ideas. We use to use the vertex, then went to orbix, but now use this system.

 

[Travis]

I use the dvas trays for my triple trays. I would like find something else that is similar. If you use a solid model to check contacts there is nothing wrong with them.

The negative is that they costs over a dollar a piece.

 

[TheLabGuy]

you have a website travis?

 

[Travis]

Model & Tray Systems :: Dental Ventures of America, Inc. - Specialty Products for the Dental Laboratory

ULTRA Twin-Tray Model System

 

[Travis]

I might give Artimax a try. I ran out of full trays today and thought about this post. Should I start out with the trial kit? What is wall and wall less?

 

[TheLabGuy]

walls, are just little lips at the base, about an 1/8 of inch (3mm). I guess it's to give more stability but I never noticed a difference, however, we do use the ones with walls. As for trial kit, that's what I'd start out with, and hey, see if they'll send you a free trial kit, they did for us.

 

[Travis]

They have a free trial kit that I ordered today. He said it came with a dvd on instructions. What no vhs? High tech

 

[TheLabGuy]

use your computer silly......lol

 

[Malcolm Graham]

Chris.
I use all stone articulators from Cbite, inc. - Dental Lab Products: Order our products. I have used the artimax and found there is still a little movement in the dies because of the pins.
The all stone bases from c bite are excellent. The dies are rock solid in the base, there are no pins to line up and they are economical. Good company to deal with too. I use the full arch for all my full arch impressions regardless of whether they are tripple tray or not, just cut the hinges off and articulate with plaster on a articultor if you wish.
The only slight down side is the die's are a little hard to take out but thats what makes them accurate so I can live with that. Hope this helps.

 

[TheLabGuy]

Interesting.......nice post. This system looks like a combination of the artimax and the orbix. I love the letters on the bottom, logo, and the piece that includes the shade/pt. name/date. I might have to order a trial kit to take a look at this. Welcome Malcolm

 

[PGguy]

Hi Malcolm,

I have used those c-bites a lot, We switched to old-fashioned pinned, because of the very fact that they a hard to get in/out of the base. Also, we found that the dies didn't always want to seat down without steaming the crap out of it. Do you have any tips because it is a very quick method?

p.s. We in fact still use them for our solid/contact model.

 

[Al.]

Hi Malcolm,

I have used those c-bites a lot, We switched to old-fashioned pinned, because of the very fact that they a hard to get in/out of the base. Also, we found that the dies didn't always want to seat down without steaming the crap out of it. Do you have any tips because it is a very quick method?

p.s. We in fact still use them for our solid/contact model.

PGguy, I cant tell up about c-bites because we use monotrac but it is similar,
After seperation we put our models in a dehydrator for 5 mins, to dry them. Even if we let them set over night, when the humitiy is high, the models are still slightly damp enough to cause dust from sawing them out to stick to the models and not allowing them to seat 100%.
Take moist dust compacted onto into the nooks and crannies of a moist model and the dies will not seat.

 

[PGguy]

PGguy, I cant tell up about c-bites because we use monotrac but it is similar,
After seperation we put our models in a dehydrator for 5 mins, to dry them. Even if we let them set over night, when the humitiy is high, the models are still slightly damp enough to cause dust from sawing them out to stick to the models and not allowing them to seat 100%.
Take moist dust compacted onto into the nooks and crannies of a moist model and the dies will not seat.

Thanks Al, I will give that a shot

 

[Malcolm Graham]

PGguy.

I like the fact that the dies are firm in the base. I find that gives me the accuracy I need to produce quality work from the first cast of the impresssion. I do use other casts from the impression to check margins, and I used to always have a third cast to check contacts, but with the c-bite I find ( if being carefiull ) I don't need the contact model .

Hints in using them. I will tell you how we use them and you can decide from there.
Firstly we spray them with a seperater, although not necessary I think it provides a little bit of retentive relief.
We give the casts an hour to set before we remove the model from the impression. Once the model is removed from the tray it does not get pushed back into the base until the model is finished. This saves any compacting of dust into the base. From there the bases are washed clean and dried off with compressed air.
The models are then cut, usually through the centre of the arch,( this all depends on where the die is ) as the horse shoe shape of the arch and the expansion from the stone will make fitting the model to the base near impossible if the majority of the cast is left in one piece.
Likewise we never take the model out of the base without cleaning it and putting it back fully into the base within the first 24 hours of casting the impression because of the setting exspansion of the stone.
We use a stiff bristle brush to clean the dust fron the retentive grooves of the model and give them a blast of compressed air to clean them. Then the models are assembled making sure they are fitted ALL the way into the base, just incase there is further expansion of the stone. I find if the models and bases are kept clean during fabrication and the models are left to complete setting expansion in the bases the system is VERY accurate. From there it is a matter of cleanlyness by keeping the wax out of the base while waxing. I will see if I can post a pic.

All The best Malcolm

 

[Al.]

Malcolm, we spray a lub., on our bases first also, its a sylicone spray.
Why do you wash your models after seperation? We just blow ours off. I like never having to rewet our models with the pinless systems.
With snug dies to you remove your bridge wax ups by pulling them off the dies or do you pop your dies to remove the wax up?

 

[Malcolm Graham]

Al.
We don't wash the models, only the bases. The models are cleaned with a brush where they fit into the base dry, and then blown off with air. We found a denture cleaning brush good for this.
I remove the bridges by either way you have mentioned, just depends on the case. If the bridge comes on and off the dies easily I remove it from the dies, longer span bridges, I ease a couple of the dies carefully out of the bases and I usually find the wax will lift off the others without any distortion.

 

[PGguy]

Thank you Malcolm, I will try it your way and see what happens