Thick super-transucent zi and dyeing problems

[BlakeHarting]

Has anyone else found a way to dye thick pieces of super-translucent zi? With bridge pontics and screw retained units the shade never fires out right.

 

[JohnWilson]

Paint on Distilled water first on the thick areas which will not allow the colorant to absorb as much

 

[Sevan P]

Paint on Distilled water first on the thick areas which will not allow the colorant to absorb as much

Or Origin has a Chroma Blocker with green die in it but Dist Water works as well.

 

[BlakeHarting]

Paint on Distilled water first on the thick areas which will not allow the colorant to absorb as much

The problem is with the thick units being too light though, not too dark. Painting h20 seems like a good idear for thick regular zi areas. Unless I'm doing something else wrong it seems like the dye doesn't absorb into the super translucent enough... Or I'm not drying them enough... they almost seem under-fired

The fire/shade seems fine at regular thickness though

 

[zero_zero]

If they're coming out too light use a shade darker...

 

[Sevan P]

Which S.H.T. zr are you using and what coloring liquids? Also what the final temp on the sintering program.

 

[BlakeHarting]

Which S.H.T. zr are you using and what coloring liquids? Also what the final temp on the sintering program.

Imagine Zi and Lava Plus liquids

Start Temperature Room Temperature

Heat Rate 1 20°C / min

Intermediate Temp 800°C

Heat Rate 2 10°C / min

HoigldhinTgemTpime 1450°C

Hold Time 2 hours

Cool Rate 1 15°C / min

Cool Temp 1 800°C

Cool Rate 2

20°C / min

Cool Temp 2 250°C

 

[Brent Harvey]

Imagine Zi and Lava Plus liquids

Start Temperature Room Temperature

Heat Rate 1 20°C / min

Intermediate Temp 800°C

Heat Rate 2 10°C / min

HoigldhinTgemTpime 1450°C

Hold Time 2 hours

Cool Rate 1 15°C / min

Cool Temp 1 800°C

Cool Rate 2

20°C / min

Cool Temp 2 250°C

Typically Labs tell me if they use lava plus liquids, they always have to go a shade darker on the Anterior Zirconia, or they will come out to light. Lava Plus Liquid is not as concentrated as the Anterior liquids on the market. Our R&D team here has also noticed the same thing.

 

[Joe]

we were seeing the same thing, using the same products. What fixed it was going with a much longer, slower ramp time.

heat rate 3°C / min

900°C hold 30min

2°C / min

1450°C hold 2 hours

cool 10°C / min

600°C no hold

20°C / min to 250°C

 

[user name]

Imagine Zi and Lava Plus liquids

Start Temperature Room Temperature

Heat Rate 1 20°C / min

Intermediate Temp 800°C

Heat Rate 2 10°C / min

HoigldhinTgemTpime 1450°C

Hold Time 2 hours

Cool Rate 1 15°C / min

Cool Temp 1 800°C

Cool Rate 2

20°C / min

Cool Temp 2 250°C

Lava Sucks. Get some DD Bio Z.

Much better color.

Jensen has some new dye coming out soon for Imagine...Im told.

 

[RileyS]

So I'm going to run some test imagine z with lava stains pieces at a dif lab to compare against my sintering unit. I find my Imagine with lava only has one hue with differing chroma with any of the shades I fire. they are all kinda in the brownish family. I can't get yellow or orangeyness that I need. Anyone else?
And I haven't had issues with thicker stuff that I've noticed Blake. Pretty consistent. Maybe give it a longer soak or after taking out of your toaster/heat lamp after first coloring hit it with a few more coats.

 

[Sevan P]

Imagine Zi and Lava Plus liquids

Start Temperature Room Temperature

Heat Rate 1 20°C / min

Intermediate Temp 800°C

Heat Rate 2 10°C / min

HoigldhinTgemTpime 1450°C

Hold Time 2 hours

Cool Rate 1 15°C / min

Cool Temp 1 800°C

Cool Rate 2

20°C / min

Cool Temp 2 250°C

\

Call Origin and ask for a sample of their liquids, you might just get a better result. If Zr mfg's have a colorant that works with their Zr it is best to stick with it. Origin has got the science down to were the results are consistent and good. For Zr mfg's that don't have a matching colorant then your on your own. It is free just call them and ask for a sample. Program looks about right, I fire my Argen Anterior at 1445 for 2hrs slow ramp as well.

 

[BlakeHarting]

we were seeing the same thing, using the same products. What fixed it was going with a much longer, slower ramp time.

heat rate 3°C / min

900°C hold 30min

2°C / min

1450°C hold 2 hours

cool 10°C / min

600°C no hold

20°C / min to 250°C

Thanks Joe. I've been drying a thick dyed chunk of Imagine all day thinking that might be the problem. If that doesn't work I'll try your cycle.

Look what I made! The greycard doesn't work as well for Imagine bc it's too translucent...

 

[Polarmolar]

I had the to light with cubix on pontics. I stained my enamels and cervical then used a chroma inhibitor like Orgins ( gonna try distilled ) then dipped. It was more consistent for me but I'm still learning so I like things to work and later on I'll get more fancy with cubix.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[PCdental]

I have the same issue. Did you find a solution?

 

[BlakeHarting]

I have the same issue. Did you find a solution?

Yes! Slower ramp time like mentioned above. Works perfectly