Trying to sort things out. Open or Closed System

[charles007]

times 240 + smartoptics 880 with exocad is my choice, from same company

Smartoptics has a newer-faster model scanner than the 880 series... just saying. I've always heard SO scanners are slow. Have no knowledge about the newest Smart Optics model other than its faster..

 

[Drizzt]

Smartoptics has a newer-faster model scanner than the 880 series... just saying. I've always heard SO scanners are slow. Have no knowledge about the newest Smart Optics model other than its faster..

Charles they are going to release it soon ?? I have also heard that 880 is very slow .

 

[Alex R.]

Thank's for info Charles. I don't have a wide assortment here in Russia, I need an articulator in CAD so SO 880 is for me. As I was told fast scanning isn't always accurate.

 

[charles007]

Alex, maybe you were told fast scanning is not accurate because they don't have the newest model to sell you ! Trust me, you are going to want the fastest scanner possible... Wait for the newer model ! or buy a different brand of scanner..

 

[Alex R.]

Wait for the newer model ! or buy a different brand of scanner..

Sorry, but it will arrive to me soon, in about 10 days. I've been waiting so long...

 

[charles007]

Sorry, but it will arrive to me soon, in about 10 days. I've been waiting so long...

Your making a big mistake to acept that scanner..
Post the total time for the scanning process, both upper and lower models.
If its near 7 minutes, I'm wrong...

 

[BobCDT]

Hello All,
First time post here. Great site.

I am looking to purchasing a CAD/CAM system. I have been researching different options but my first decision is whether or not go with an open or closed system. Manufacturers from both sides have some valid points for their respective position.

Companies that sell "open" say why restrict your options of materials and if necessary, only their recommended milling centers. That sounds like a reasonable question to me.

On the other side, the companies that sell "closed" systems says who will support you if things don't go as planned. Their system are made to play together so less problems. As we all know in this field things don't always go like we would like them to go so that sounds like another reasonable question.

If I were to purchase say a 3shape scanner and a Roland DWX-50 and things don't go smoothly at some point what is the chance I'm caught in the middle of 3shape saying the problem lies in the mill and the mill saying its the scanners fault....you get the idea.

I know the reseller is of utmost importance. An example of what make me nervous is I'm still trying to get an online quote after several weeks and multiple requests from a reseller of both 3shape and Roland. They will go nameless for now. This is what kind of scares me about resellers to a degree. I can't even get a quote......What happens when I have a problem. That being said I know there is no obligation to get it out in a timely manner but if they really want to sell a system time is of the essence.



Here is a little bit of my background.
I am a one person lab so cost is somewhat of a concern.
I already have a some experience on the most basic level of digital workflow. I have the Procera Piccolo
I'm not ruling anything out but am looking more closely at 3shape/Roland DWX-50 vs. Jensen system. Honorable mention is NobelProcera partly because I am familiar with Nobel.

Is this and should this be a legitimate concern on deciding which type of system to purchase. I don't want to get caught in the middle. Worst case scenario would be to spend 70 grand+ on a system that I can't get to play nicely together.

I know systems will have to be refined and fine tuned no matter whether I choose an open or close system but are there real problems that do arise on a regular basis with open systems?

I guess I'm just trying to separate a sales pitch from the truth.....

Sorry to be so long winded

Any and all thoughts, suggestions or ideas are welcomed......Hope to see some of you in Chicago.

Thanks,

Tom

Hi Tom,
This is Bob from CAP. First, thanks to all for the positive posts in the thread about CAP. At CAP we sell only fully open, fully Intergrated CAD CAM solutions. In fact, we have CAP specific intergrations that privide superior results with less labor. We sell 3Shape, Roland and Imes Icore mills. In addition, for a lab your size you really need to go through an in depth ROI to make sure this punches is going to be a correct business decision for you. If you would like we will help you through this process. Absolutely no pressure sales or preasure to buy. You can fill out an ROI contact form here Roland DWX-50 Dental Mill | Custom Automated Prosthetics and we will contact you.
In addition to selling fully open, Intergrated solutions, we provide an extensive training at you facility and once trained we have a large support staff available by phone that have all worked with equipmet we sell. They field dozens of CAD CAM questions every day. So, once your done with initial training we will continue to support you to insure long term success.
From all the threads i have read and personal past experience I would definitely reccomed buying open ONLY. Many people become very disenchanted with closed systems after a short period of time.
If you would like to discuss this further please feel free to give me a call 877-977-7889.
Either way, good luck.
Bob

 

[cumino]

Great thread...I'm coming from a slightly different route as a one person operation...

- want to design my own units, and send the design for milling... am not concerned about speed, if its slow, its slow!

- cant justify (or afford!) buying a new scanner and software, am seeing second hand units coming on the market but am not sure which may be worth considering. I know I will have to buy licenses etc...but dont want to end up with a unit that the company no longer supports...

- has to be open.

suggestions?

cheers

 

[paulg100]

"Their system are made to play together so less problems"

REALLY! is that what "they" say. Sirona sells a closed system for labs.. go buy that and let us know how many problems you have and what you think of the support you get

Guess what im saying is dont believe everything "they" say.

 

[TAB]

Hi Tom,
This is Bob from CAP. First, thanks to all for the positive posts in the thread about CAP. At CAP we sell only fully open, fully Intergrated CAD CAM solutions. In fact, we have CAP specific intergrations that privide superior results with less labor. We sell 3Shape, Roland and Imes Icore mills. In addition, for a lab your size you really need to go through an in depth ROI to make sure this punches is going to be a correct business decision for you. If you would like we will help you through this process. Absolutely no pressure sales or preasure to buy. You can fill out an ROI contact form here Roland DWX-50 Dental Mill | Custom Automated Prosthetics and we will contact you.
In addition to selling fully open, Intergrated solutions, we provide an extensive training at you facility and once trained we have a large support staff available by phone that have all worked with equipmet we sell. They field dozens of CAD CAM questions every day. So, once your done with initial training we will continue to support you to insure long term success.
From all the threads i have read and personal past experience I would definitely reccomed buying open ONLY. Many people become very disenchanted with closed systems after a short period of time.
If you would like to discuss this further please feel free to give me a call 877-977-7889.
Either way, good luck.
Bob

Thanks Bob,

You had no way of knowing it was me at the time but we had a conversation after your talk in Chicago on Friday morning. Lots of good information in your lecture and I enjoyed speaking with you afterward.

I met up with Sam down at your booth and I'm in the process of getting a detailed quote from him. I will follow up with an ROI request from you guys soon.

Thanks,

Tom

 

[TAB]

"Their system are made to play together so less problems"

REALLY! is that what "they" say. Sirona sells a closed system for labs.. go buy that and let us know how many problems you have and what you think of the support you get

Guess what im saying is dont believe everything "they" say.

Thanks paulg100

There's pretty much no doubt I'm going open. The only time I would think longer and harder about it is if I were doing a LOT of implant bars. I would then look at NobelProcera but I don't foresee myself doing that at this point.