Medical Device tax

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rosarioortholab

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From what I'm reading and seeing in obamacare the manufacterer of medical devices ( Dental Labs included) are going to be responsible for paying this tax. Has anyone outthere
begun the process of preparing to bill the Doctors for this fee ? If so Can anyone elaborate.
 
Inman Labs

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From what I'm reading and seeing in obamacare the manufacterer of medical devices ( Dental Labs included) are going to be responsible for paying this tax. Has anyone outthere
begun the process of preparing to bill the Doctors for this fee ? If so Can anyone elaborate.

My accountant feels this will not happen, I sent him an article about it and he said not to worry too much about it.
I pay him for advise and I cannot research everything for myself so I am choosing not to worry too much about it.
As I remember it was 2.3% or something like that and it was buried somewhere in a new bill but my accountant feels the bill will be defeated.
I am super dumb when it comes to this stuff so if I am wrong I apologize upfront.

Regards,
Don
 
AJEL

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The Supreme Court ruling to uphold the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act (PPACA June 28th 2012
The IRS has not come out with the complete rules yet, & this will be collected thru the IRS as an excise tax on the gross of New Durable Medical Appliances. I am a technician as is Don, my accountant has no opinion (until rules are published) but suggested I start separating the new appliances from repaired in my accounting package. The parts used will be also be taxed to the lab As a gross tax the parts are not deducted nor labor or other expenses to come up with a net. It could possibly in theory be equal to a 11-20% value on the net. It is a tax on what you charge not on what you made on the new appliance.
But then possibly the chairman of the Cook group is wrong and this financing method for the portable health care bill will be abandoned. The PPACA 2.3% excise tax is expected to raise as much as $60 billion over the next 10 years, there must be some other place to find that pocket change. Maybe the politicians will give up their pay raise, or the commander in chief could give up a vacation or two, hasn't the general population done so!

Stephen Ferguson, Chairman of the Board, The Cook Group http://www.cookgroup.com/profile/index.html
Why has Cook taken such a vocal stance in the effort to repeal the 2.3% medical device tax?
The medical device tax is top-line in nature. What does this mean and how will it impact the bottom line for medical device companies?
Can't medical device companies just pass along the increased costs to their customers?
Don't forget to keep track of any gifts or promotion items, or discounts you may send out for the reporting requirements of Sunshine Act also starting Jan1,2013.
Sory if I sound a little scared but I am. unfortunately there is 5 min of promo. There is a transcript of the interview at this page as well.
http://medsider.com/interviews/will-the-medical-device-tax-force-you-to-the-unemployment-line-interview-steve-ferguson-cook/

http://www.irs.gov/irb/2012-13_IRB/ar12.html
http://www.irs.gov/irb/2012-13_IRB/ar12.html

There was a meting that was to be open to the public & a webinar on May 7 I registered for the meeting but when I went to log in the meeting; it was closed. There was an IDLA meeting in June, fortunately the clinician had been to the meeting.
 
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Thanks AJEL for being the eyes, and so much of the brains for us. Youre an asset.
 
corona

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from the little i heard ..... even if the 2.3 exise tax gets repealed ,we will still have about 9 months to a whole year of this tax . gov is slow to start stuff and then slowerrrr to stop stuff so ........

I am preparing myself for the worst and hoping for the best ( that the tax gets repealed) . I am already starting to tell my accounts whats going on .
Also .... not only are we going to be taxed but the materials we buy will get the same tax so that means a minimum of 4.6 tax!!!!! please make adjustments as necessary or the profit margin will take that hit instead . Thanks AJEL for keeping up with all the valuable info .

If all this is true then would a nice round number of say.... 6% increase (2.3 excise lab +2.3 material increase + inflation ) be a good number to start with ? Also i heard that we CANNOT state the excise tax on our invoices ... it has to be hidden or lumped in with the price increase . does anyone have any info in that regard ??? what do you guys think?
 
AJEL

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Don my accountant keeps me legal & I trust her, The information has not gotten to accounting boards yet. it has not been published with the forms that will need to be filled out yet.
Corona a 2.3% on gross as it was explained to me, does not take into account deductions, such as materials,depreciation, rent, utilities, logistics, or labor. Maria worked backwards with me to show me that 2.3% for my lab numbers is a 16%net tax (Your income tax is a tax on your net.) So to make the same profit next year I would need to increase prices 16% (I suspect the loss of a few accounts.)
You could make the tax a line item; but as the tax is on the gross it would become part of the gross and increase the tax by taxing itself, your choice (I asked at the NADL meeting)
No brains here just suborn prodding, I have been asking about this over a year, I tell ya it is worse than pulling teeth!!!
I'm feeling sleepy But you should enjoy some Friedman quotes; they are universal & work in every country!!!
Milton Friedman "Nothing is so permanent as a temporary government program"
"We have a system that increasingly taxes work and subsidizes nonwork."
“Many people want the government to protect the consumer. A much more urgent problem is to protect the consumer from the government.”
“Hell hath no fury like a bureaucrat scorned.”
“Most of the energy of political work is devoted to correcting the effects of mismanagement of government”
http://dentallabnetwork.com/forums/f57/2-3-percent-new-annual-tax-u-s-sales-2013-a-7987/
 
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You could make the tax a line item; but as the tax is on the gross it would become part of the gross and increase the tax by taxing itself, your choice (I asked at the NADL meeting)

From latest irs publication:
The taxable sale price of a taxable article also includes, among other things, any charge for coverings or containers (regardless of their nature),and any charge incident to placing the article in a condition to be packed and ready for shipment. However, the taxable sale price excludes (i) the manufacturers excise tax, whether or not it is stated as a separate charge; (ii) the actual cost of transportation, delivery, insurance, installation, and other expenses incurred by the manufacturer or importer in placing the article in the hands of the purchaser pursuant to a bona fide sale

Looks like the NADL can not even figure out this tax. Lets all hope it gets repealed
Why not just lower your crown price and add a hefty "delivery" charge:)
Theres got to be loopholes somewhere
 
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The taxable sale price of a taxable article also includes, among other things, any charge for coverings or containers (regardless of their nature),and any charge incident to placing the article in a condition to be packed and ready for shipment. However, the taxable sale price excludes (i) the manufacturers excise tax, whether or not it is stated as a separate charge; (ii) the actual cost of transportation, delivery, insurance, installation, and other expenses incurred by the manufacturer or importer in placing the article in the hands of the purchaser pursuant to a bona fide sale
This is a definition of a tax on a net sale, the portable healthcare bill durable medical device tax is a tax on a gross sale the value prior to any deductions taken.
A net tax would be my Brux $155. - material $25. - packaging & shipping $20.= $100. tax $2.3 (just simple)
A gross tax is my Brux $155. tax $3.57+the .57 I will be taxed on material.

Mark Jackson I would love to hear from him haven't seen much lately.
Johnwilson is another individual I would wish to hear from on this matter.
They are both buisness persons planning away, I would believe with good solid footing on this. As we all hope for a repeal of this business killing tax.
 
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ccdental

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The above irs publication quote was directly from the latest irs publication on the new medical device tax. According to this it is a tax on the net.
Just relaying what my account has found out. I'll see if I can find the pdf link if you are interested in reading it.
 
AJEL

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Thanks the more we can figure out the closer we will be to have 2013 in control. It would still be nicer if it could be done a way with. Kind of like being taxed 2x on your work. Freidman was so right. We have a system that increasingly taxes work and subsidizes nonwork.
 
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rosarioortholab

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The irony of obamacare is in order to make healthcare more affordable it's going to tax insurers,medical device manufacters, and pharma thus increasing costs across the board. I believe it's not about affordability but increased ACCESS. This expense is going to be huge for everyone. When it does Obama will be long gone. The next president will have to deal with the repercussions.
 
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Well good thing Ortho labs aren't actually making "medical devices" we make removable retention devices which fall under a class 1 like mouth guards. a sleep apnea appliance would fall under this category. I believe in not making accusations about what possibly *might* happen until it does! thats just me a realist
 
corona

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Well good thing Ortho labs aren't actually making "medical devices" we make removable retention devices which fall under a class 1 like mouth guards. a sleep apnea appliance would fall under this category. I believe in not making accusations about what possibly *might* happen until it does! thats just me a realist

i dont think your exempt smilewire ..could be wrong ....isnt that saying the same thing that removable labs will be exempt because they are removable devices as well ??
 
Smilewire

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you could be right, I really do not know? but then a cotton roll is a medical device then too. There going to have to figure out how they will charge it and to what point it will be charged. FDA's Definition:
A device is:

"an instrument, apparatus, implement, machine, contrivance, implant, in vitro reagent, or other similar or related article, including a component part, or accessory which is:

recognized in the official National Formulary, or the United States Pharmacopoeia, or any supplement to them,
intended for use in the diagnosis of disease or other conditions, or in the cure, mitigation, treatment, or prevention of disease, in man or other animals, or
intended to affect the structure or any function of the body of man or other animals, and which does not achieve any of it's primary intended purposes through chemical action within or on the body of man or other animals and which is not dependent upon being metabolized for the achievement of any of its primary intended purposes."


Anyway's all this Chicken little stuff is starting to drive me nuts! I'm just a little bored of the what if's and over simplified generalizations backed up by opinion news channels. The proof is in the pudding
 
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Smilewire

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Not sure how that adds to the conversation. You know there is a politics area in this network, I just see it as a huge slap in the face to all the active military but that's what their protecting after all, your ability to have your opinion. So opinion away
 
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Well. Here we are October 20 2012. What have you done to prepare for this new tax that takes effect January 1st.

Is this a tax that you will pass on to our accounts?
Is your billing program able to calculate this new tax?

Let us know what your plans are....
 
doug

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You can thank the NADL for their hard work in this matter. If you're not a member, join. This is part of what your dues will pay.



October 19, 2012 Bennett Napier, CAE 800/950-1150



National Association of Dental Laboratories Legal Analysis Determines that the IRS proposed rule will not subject most products made by domestic dental laboratories to the new federal Medical Device Excise Tax

Tallahassee, FL: The National Association of Dental Laboratories, the trade association representing the interests of nearly 10,000 dental laboratories in the United States has put forth a legal analysis that indicates that most finished devices made in a dental laboratory setting will not be subject to the new federal Medical Device Excise Tax which goes into effect January 1, 2013.

Since Congress passed the Affordable Health Care Act in 2010, the NADL has worked diligently to educate the industry on the elements of the medical device excise tax requirements that may affect dental laboratories. When the law was first passed, there was perspective that due to the broad FDA definition of “medical device”, devices made in the laboratory setting at that point of sale would be subject to the tax.

The Internal Revenue Service has recently published proposed rules relative to implementing the new law. NADL, through the work of its in-house legal review and the outside-counsel, has determined that the published IRS proposed rule does not subject most devices made in the domestic dental laboratory setting to the medical device excise tax.

This legal analysis is based on the definition of “taxable medical device” set forth in the proposed IRS rule. (See §48.4191-2) In order for a device to be subject to the new tax and considered a “taxable medical device”, it must be a device listed that is required to be listed as a device with the FDA. While many of the materials such as alloys or ceramics that are used to make dental restorations are devices that are listed with the FDA, a domestic dental laboratory that makes dental devices that are not required to be listed with the FDA will not have to register with the IRS and will not have to file quarterly Medical Device Tax returns.



The majority of dental devices made by domestic dental laboratories does not have an FDA product code and are not required to be listed with the FDA.



“This means that if the IRS adopts the Proposed Rule on taxable medical devices then domestically made crowns, bridges, dentures, veneers, and some orthodontic appliances will not be subject to the medical device tax at the point of sale from the dental laboratory to the dentist. This is very good news for many domestic dental laboratories and will save most domestic dental laboratories from the considerable cost of compliance and logistical burdens that most businesses in our industry would otherwise face beginning January 1, 2013” says Warren Rogers, CEO of Knight Dental Group, Oldsmar, FL and president of NADL.



“We are pleased with the proposed IRS definition, nonetheless, there are certain devices made in a dental laboratory setting that are required to be listed with the FDA and as a result will meet the IRS definition of a “taxable medical device”. Those products include imported restorations made by foreign dental laboratories since those devices are required to be listed with the FDA. Sleep apnea devices and some dental implant devices made by domestic dental laboratories must also be listed with the FDA. Those dental laboratories that make devices that are required to be listed will be subject to quarterly IRS filing and remitting the 2.3% medical device tax beginning in 2013“ says Eric Thorn, Esquire, NADL in-house counsel.



For domestic dental laboratories, they are likely to see the 2.3% device tax cost impact when they buy materials and equipment from dental manufacturers and suppliers, as most of the raw materials used by dental laboratories to make a completed dental device have an FDA product code and are required to be listed with the FDA. As a result those materials will be subject to the medical device tax.

Dental laboratories can obtain basic information on the NADL legal analysis at National Association of Dental Laboratories NADL - (800)950-1150. Members of the association have access to comprehensive guidance.

# # #

PLEASE SHARE THIS ANALYSIS WITH YOUR OR LEGAL OR TAX ACCOUNTING PROFESSIONAL TO DETERMINE ITS APPLICABILITY TO YOU INDIVIDUAL BUSINESS ACTIVITIES.

NOTHING IN THIS ANALYSIS IS INTENDED AS OR SHOULD BE CONSTRUED AS OR RELIED UPON AS U.S. FEDERAL TAX ADVICE AND CAN NOT BE USED FOR THE PURPOSE OF AVOIDING ANY PENALTIES UNDER THE INTERNAL REVENUE CODE.



Background



Dental Laboratories make crowns, bridges, dentures, dental implants, mouth guards and orthodontic devices such as retainers and sleep apnea devices and snore guards. The materials and components used to make these items (such as alloys, ceramic, resins, abutments, individual denture teeth, etc.) are listed with the FDA using FDA product codes.

With the exception of sleep apnea devices and snore guards, the devices that are domestically made by dental laboratories from the FDA listed and FDA product coded components are not required to be listed with the FDA and do not have any FDA product code. For example there is not a code for a porcelain-fused-to-metal crown or for a finished set of dentures or a completed dental implant.

While the FDA requires all establishments that manufacture medical devices to register with the FDA and requires these establishments to list the devices that they manufacture with the FDA pursuant to 21 CFR 807, dental laboratories are specifically exempted.

§ 807.65(i) exempts domestic dental laboratories from the FDA’s device listing requirements. However, if a dental laboratory undertakes certain activities, such as importing devices or manufacturing sleep apnea devices or snore guards, the dental laboratory will be required to register with the FDA and list those devices with the FDA using the applicable FDA product code(s). Imported crowns, bridges, dentures, dental implants, mouth guards and orthodontic devices such as retainers are required to be listed with the FDA and do have an applicable FDA product code.



It is important to note that the IRS definition of importer that applies to excise taxes is different from the FDA’s importer definition. Under the IRS definition of “importer” the person who brings an article into the United States is only a nominal importer if they are not also the beneficial owner of the article. For example, if you engage a customs broker they are a nominal importer and the IRS deems the beneficial owner to be the importer, in this case which may be the U.S. dental laboratory that is selling the device for excise tax purposes. See 26 CFR 48.0-2(a)(4) for the IRS definition of “importer.”



Taxable Medical Device – IRS Guidance to date

§ 48.4191–2 Taxable medical device. (as currently proposed by the IRS)

(a) Taxable medical device—(1) In general. A taxable medical device is any device, as defined in section 201(h) of the Federal Food, Drug, and Cosmetic Act, that is intended for humans. For purposes of this section, a device defined in section 201(h) of the Federal Food, Drug, and Cosmetic Act that is intended for humans means a device that is listed as a device with the Food and Drug Administration (FDA) under

section 510(j) of the Federal Food, Drug, and Cosmetic Act and 21 CFR part 807, pursuant to FDA requirements. (emphasis added)



As stated in the IRS’s commentary that was published in the preamble of proposed rule:



“Therefore, all devices that are listed under a single product code listing in conjunction with the FDA’s device listing requirement are ‘‘taxable medical devices’’ unless they fall within an exemption under section 4191(b)(2). “ 77 Fed. Reg. 25 (7 February 2012) p. 6029



The IRS clearly states that any device listed under a single FDA product code is a “taxable medical device”. The IRS does not anywhere in the proposed rules or in the accompanying commentary or elsewhere indicate that anything other than a device that is required to be listed is a “taxable medical device”.



FDA Dental Device Product Codes



In 21 CFR 872 the FDA has promulgated the 132 generic classifications of the dental devices intended for human use that are in commercial distribution. Each one of these generic classifications has one or more associated three-letter FDA product codes. There are 297 three letter FDA product codes that apply to dental devices.



21 CFR 872 - Dental device classifications:

CFR - Code of Federal Regulations Title 21



FDA Dental Device Product Codes:

Product Classification



Dental device establishments that are required to register use these 297 FDA product codes in order to list with the FDA the devices they manufacture. There are no applicable FDA product codes for domestically made crowns, bridges, dentures, dental implants, mouth guards and orthodontic devices such as retainers.
 
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