Looking for advise on the best way to get started after thirty-seven years in C&B.

[Big_Rick]

As stated in the title, I have been doing C&B since I graduated in 1976. Went to work for my father and stayed with him for twenty years then launched my own lab. Now, with the still slow economy, I think the best way for me to grow my business is to start doing dentures. The accounts I have asked are encouraging me to do it, stating they will definitely send work. That being said, what would you, my adopted gurus suggest as the best way to get started correctly.

I have watched many hours of videos on youtube and have read Dr. Sowters book Removable Prosthodontic Techniques. To date I have had no hands on experience. Thank you!

I am a one man lab.

 

[nvarras]

Boucher's prosthodontic treatment for edentulous patients is another good read. Take some hands on CE courses and start slow until you develop a comfort level with the materials you are going to use which brings up another point....what materials are you going to use and what kind of removables do you want to offer that will to some extent determine your materials.

 

[Marcusthegladiator CDT]

How you gonna get it all done by yourself?

Your answer should be,
"Very Carefully."

 

[AJEL]

The economy may be slow but removable has not paid what C&B has since the 60's, are you sure you want to do the work required, dentures are a lot more work for quite a bit less return.
I have had several C&B techs come here, they don't like dealing with 28 empty spaces and then they don't like how little it pays. Most of them had no concept of curve of spea or wilson let alone balancing compensating arches.
Big-Rick where are you located?

 

[lcmlabforum]

My removable guy (one of them) is trying to retire after many years and
cannot find buyers to take over even though he has lots of clients.
I do them all the time, but most find that Removable is more headache
than it is worth unless your DDS can charge enough and not be nickel
and dime kind of person. Repairs and relines are even riskier - you think
it is smaller job but comes with whole baggage of their pre-existing problems.
Maybe start with simple night guards (vacuum form, hard and soft)
and something temporary only.
Good luck,
LCM

 

[Flipperlady]

I'm in removable dentures , however if I were to ever cross over, I would make nothing but gold crowns, I would specialize in this.

 

[AJEL]

flippercentral

I'm in removable dentures , however if I were to ever cross over, I would make nothing but gold crowns, I would specialize in this

.
Yes but flipper would yo really want to move from the dark side to the shiny side? I have a classmate who specializes in gold & logo in tooth C&B, he likes it but talk about nintch markets!!!
Lee one of the C&B techs came over to learn to make a balanced brux, and had a fit, she never thought about how the other side has to work before, but I will admit I think her crowns are better now. She did give up and is working part time for another lab she does do some nice porclain, & is one of the few who can make a crown that a current partial can fit.

 

[Big_Rick]

I know our industry is not what it used to be. My dad could pay cash for a new car when I was a kid doing mostly gold work. He used to process acrylic veneers to gold bridge work, before porcelain became widely used. Back in the day we never did removable work because we had all the C&B we could handle. It`s not like that any more. I thought about going into cad/cam but see that as self defeating. I want to finish my working life in dentistry and see dentures as the means to accomplish that.

As far as how to get it all done, even when I`m busy I have some time to fill. I also can press my wife into service if I need her. She is a great plaster/stone tech and can do some waxing and porcelain work too. I am in a rural area in Michigan that is heavily tourist dependent.

Because of what I have read on this forum I plan to do traditional packing. It also seems to be the least expensive way to go, which is a plus. Initially I also want to do flexible partials. Again, from what people here have had to say, I am thinking TCS is the way to go.

Does anyone know if the beginners class at Dentsply is worth taking? A lot of what they cover is self promoting. I have some experience with light cured materials for custom trays etc.

I appreciate your replies and any additional advise you care to offer.

 

[AJEL]

In all truth, if you like doing Removable great for you, if you think you can buy a flask press, bench lathe, deep fryer and start making lots of money, you will find that dream bubble fast broken.
It's great that your wife will do plaster work, C&B is 30min plaster per case, dentures is 1-3 hrs plaster per case. 1 Crown is $25. material less than hour work & $75.-$150. charged out. or over $50. per hr profit
A Single plate denture is 15-25 hrs work in MI average Denture $259. If you use cheap NH like teeth your materials is around $75. so if you could match me (45 years experience) and make a denture in 15 hrs for your area you would be making $259-75=184/15= $12.25 per hr charged out.
That is calculating that you get free deliveries or do you own otherwise add your delivery cost into the materials. An average denture goes to the DDS at least 3x sometimes 10 trips.
I hear from C&B techs & they come in to try it out how easy I have it until they try dentures. I can carve a crown, I do not have the color eye to do Ceramics( although from some of what I have seen I could do as well) Ialso do not like just sitting in one spot most of the day, I have been to friends C&B labs tey pretty much have one or 2 sitting stations & sometimes a plaster bench. Waxing & setting teeth is done sitting, plaster, processing finishng in every removable lab I have been to is done standing.
The Densply course is ok the Ivoclair course is more expensive & the same about self promoting but a little better.
If your area is tourist dependent I would try to learn to do repairs (broken denture, reline, cracked, lost tooth, panic stuff.) if you are good at it profit is best, but if you have quite a bit of work in the lab can really $crew up your day.

 

[Big_Rick]

Ajel, I understand the profit margins are smaller in most removable work. As a C&B lab I have seen twenty-five percent of the gravy (single pfm`s) switched to milled crowns where I become a middle man for the milling center and profit goes out the window. I am basically trying to buy myself a job, not get rich.

You are onto something when you mention the repair work. I get calls all of the time from people with a broken this or that on their dentures. They are always referred to my nearest account with a "sorry I could`nt help".

I guess after so many years as a C&B tech I am looking forward to the challenge of dentures. I am quite confident it`s a steep learning curve and fraught with many frustrations. When I talked to my eighty-two year old father about it (he`s still sharp as a tack) he said about dentures, "they`re complicated". If he thinks that I know I`d better count on it!

 

[rkm rdt]

Rick, have you considered working for someone else?

If you're just interested in buying a job, then maybe you could bring your services and clients over to a lab that could use your experience of 37 years.

I'm sure they could use someone like you to help out in QC of the c&b dept and you could also learn dentures on the side without the expense you are sure to incur.

This is your best exit strategy IMO.

 

[AJEL]

rick

When I talked to my eighty-two year old father about it (he`s still sharp as a tack) he said about dentures, "they`re complicated". If he thinks that I know I`d better count on it!

I'm so jealous that you can still talk with your dad, lost mine inn Feb 98, He would have been 83 this year.
a picture of him in mid 1980's at what was Baasch Dental Lab. In this picture he was in his late 50's where I am now. Check your PM

[/URL][/IMG]