Is Ivoclar killing Sagemax?

[Affinity]

Ill bite though, go ahead and explain how you think automation creates more dental jobs for humans? Because you create the automation your opinion is skewed. GW automation has already cut the industry probably in half. Good or bad thats a fact sir. In the same magazine, a Dr boasts about doing 250 units a month with one dental assistant running two mills. Which I dont believe.. 16 days/month / 250 crowns is 15+ crowns everyday.. but GW is looking to automate all of that so there is no need for a lab tech in the historical sense.. I know youre not a dummy so what is so funny? Make your point, dont just meme and run.

 

[CoolHandLuke]

for all Glidewell's power to automate they simply have no vision.

they havent envisioned a worker-less factory. theyve simply envisioned a quicker process for the same factory.

like taking nibbles of some delicious steak instead of proper bites.

this AI is limited in function from the off. good (ha) for single units. it relies on having an opposing AND adjacent teeth. i'll be impressed when they can figure out some actual ingenious use of AI.

this is like those long lines on an amusement park ride - theyve invented a line bypass to get through it quicker. they have not figured out a better line.

i have.

 

[rkm rdt]

Don't forget the hairless cat.

 

[CoolHandLuke]

i never forget a ****y.

 

[Affinity]

Yeah and bruxzir used to be ugly. The process will get perfected. Im not chicken little here, but Im also not even 40 years old yet, and Im just wondering where this all is leading if I want to have a future in this field, (which I dont). If GW is the walmart of the industry, its only a matter of time until an Apple comes along..

I wasnt saying that GW envisions a workerless factory, just a lab with less paid sickly puny humans...

 

[CoolHandLuke]

yet the format in which bruxzir are made has not changed. its still a crown you have to sit there and fit, stain, trim sprues and grind occlusion if its off.

the same as any crown. start with a scan, do a design, yadda yadda yadda, sit at the bench waiting for it to come out of the machine with work left to be done. one hand of the lab is a machine, the other hand of the lab is a human pair of eyes and hands to work on it once its been worked on.

nobody has factored in yet how to make both hands of the lab. everyone wants to do backwards cadcam - mill or print wax for casting. mill a model. print a model and futz with precision machined chunks of things that werent machined right (because it wasnt designed right) constantly chasing tail where the problems in the case have come up. was it a corruption or oversight on the design? is the mill not calibrated? why don't i know these things and stay on top of them?

you need automation at every level. every single level.

GW still employs techs to "finish" cases. i say if it isn't done off the machine, it isn't done right. if it can't be done by robot, it doesn't need doing.

 

[rkm rdt]

Until you find your girlfriend with a robot.....then you'll have to use your hands again.

 

[Affinity]

The auto industry has been automated for decades, and Ive even been in the BMW factory.. humans still run every step. Im not saying that AI will take away all of the work, but if GW can 'market' a solution to dentists that eliminates even their own assistant/in-house tech, by designing and milling with the click of a button, its only going to make it that much easier to eliminate our industry..The first step is ' a better designed crown' then next year its 'the new and improved all-around digital dental tech' on a usb stick.

 

[CoolHandLuke]

as i said, thats not glidewell's vision. they don't have any.

they are satisfied nibbling at the pie and crying at the "disappearing art form"

 

[Affinity]

Nibbling at the pie? Id say theyve got at least 50% of it, everyone else is getting the crumbs. Every office in the country has their materials in it and Id bet that 90% of them have used them at least once. Every office I do work for sends to GW for something.

 

[CoolHandLuke]

thats not the pie i meant. nibbling at the process of making prosthetics. they don't innovate whole sectors, just one element.

gall me when glidewell has a chairside cerec unit that doesnt need staining, trimming, glazing, or sintering. their chairside mill you still have to go through the process of playing lab technician for a day to make a unit. they have essentially made just a tool for the technician, not replaced the technician with actual brainboxing.

 

[Affinity]

Maybe were talking about two different things. I dont see anyone else innovating like they have to pull a huge segment of the market to their corner.. and I think that only means that theyre maybe the only ones with R and D money to get to the next level.. but I also think they arent going to cut off the limb theyre sitting on.

I was just reading some glassdoor reviews of GW, funny stuff.

 

[Car 54]

If Glidewell doesn't do it, Sirona will. They are the other gorilla on the block.