e.max monolithic molar

[Treasurediver]

:Hey, guys. I'm a new member here, and I'm loving the site.
Here is some of my work. It's a pressed monolithic e.max. Please feel free to critique, I've got pretty thick skin at this stage in my life.

 

[paulg100]

Looks fine on the model. :top:

The question is what does it look like in the mouth, any photos?

Its great having all the different opacities and techniques with emax but it does take experience in learning what will mask what, how thick it needs to be etc, etc, to get good color matches.

 

[Treasurediver]

It's going to be seated on Tuesday. We will see. It was a tough one, a mix of two Vita 3-D shades.

 

[charles007]

:Hey, guys. I'm a new member here, and I'm loving the site.
Here is some of my work. It's a pressed monolithic e.max. Please feel free to critique, I've got pretty thick skin at this stage in my life.

OK... From one NC Tarheel, very nice, love the anatomy, sweet ! If your a Duke fan... looks like crap

Please share the ingot and shade your trying to match, and how you did it.. I'm try to stain an A2 ingot with a 2M2 shade right now ....

Charles

 

[TheLabGuy]

Yeah, I have to agree with Paul here...We could ALL sit here and show nice e.max work like this but with e.max, the real work is ingot selection/clinical photo's (i.e. value). Personally, I like to use HT posteriorly (drop a shade though) and use the impulse V1 ingots for almost all my lighter shades (i.e. A1, B1). Then throw in MO or LT where you need to cover up some stumps. Great communication with a few of your Doctors will help you find out what's best where and when...that's the work to e.max in my opinion.

 

[Treasurediver]

I was mistaken, this was only a match to a single 3-D shade, 2M1 with a stump shade of ND3. According to the conversion table that I have it is a 50/50 mix of A1 and D2. So I pressed it in LTA1 and used the D-shade stain to match it to the tab. We typically press our full contour molars in the LT ingots. If the restoration is anything other than a full contour (Inlays, onlays, 3/4 crowns, etc.) we use the HT ingots. It has worked pretty well for us so far.

I also realize that I may have come across a bit like the new guy fishing for a compliment with this post. The fact is that my business partner and I are new lab owners and have only been in business for about eight months. I left a very stable job at an established lab and, with a growing family needing me to have more flexible working hours, decided to open my own place. After several months of marketing every day and paying a visit to nearly every dentist in my area, the work was still not coming in. ‘Failed Business’ became the words that loomed larger with every passing day that yielded no cases coming into the lab. Just when my business partner and I were about to close the doors, sell the assets, and find employment at the local mega-lab, we got some encouraging exchanges from Rob (TheLabGuy) who shared his personal experience of opening his lab and the doubt and uncertainty that a business faces in its infancy. His words encouraged us and we decided to press on for another month.

In February we picked up a big account. Since then we have picked up some minor ones that are growing larger with each case we deliver. The crown I posted a picture of was not meant to be me beating my own chest or to show off my skills. To us, more than anything else, it represents a triumph over what looked like certain collapse. Over the last few months we have used this forum (under my business partner’s screen name) to help with many issues that have popped up (short presses, cracked rings, etc.). Without the wisdom gained from the collective knowledge on this forum, it would not have been possible. Thanks to all of you for taking time to help others out.

P.S. I also hate it when a company places a crown on a piece of black velvet and shows it off in a magazine without any photos of it in the mouth. So, from that standpoint, I’m guilty as charged. If I can get some pics of the crown after it is seated, I’ll post them.

 

[lcmlabforum]

2M1 to hide a ND3 - I really want to see the picture from the mouth!
Where did you apply the D2 stain- was it difficult to control the stain or did
you air-abrade just where you need it to go?
Hang in there, buddy (if I may be so bold). Things tend to take a dive every now and then but positive thinking like those from the likes of Rob and many others is all that's needed to change things around. Best wishes for a successful business and strong family. We have a (almost) 3 year old and my heart goes out to you as well.
!
LCM

 

[TheLabGuy]

I also realize that I may have come across a bit like the new guy fishing for a compliment with this post. The fact is that my business partner and I are new lab owners and have only been in business for about eight months. I left a very stable job at an established lab and, with a growing family needing me to have more flexible working hours, decided to open my own place. After several months of marketing every day and paying a visit to nearly every dentist in my area, the work was still not coming in. ‘Failed Business’ became the words that loomed larger with every passing day that yielded no cases coming into the lab. Just when my business partner and I were about to close the doors, sell the assets, and find employment at the local mega-lab, we got some encouraging exchanges from Rob (TheLabGuy) who shared his personal experience of opening his lab and the doubt and uncertainty that a business faces in its infancy. His words encouraged us and we decided to press on for another month.

Hey, I know who you are...
This is GREAT news, I've often wondered how you made out. This kind of stuff makes my year right here. Now don't get lackadaisical on yourself, keep pounding those feet per say. Many lab owners get complacent with staring at their bench all day when YOU have to make time to work on new marketing strategies, new techniques, meets and greets with existing accounts, you always must be getting new accounts if you want to grow. Once you get a few accounts under your belt it gets easier because you have them to fall back on and even they might have a Dentist friend who is looking for a lab as well.....hint, hint. Always remember your Quality and Communication and the greatest advice I can share with anyone on here (and something I battle with daily) "IS THAT YOU CAN BE ANYTHING TO ANYONE, ONLY AFTER YOUR EVERYTHING TO YOURSELF FIRST". Please keep us posted...

 

[TheLabGuy]

2M1 to hide a ND3 - I really want to see the picture from the mouth!
Where did you apply the D2 stain- was it difficult to control the stain or did
you air-abrade just where you need it to go?
Hang in there, buddy (if I may be so bold). Things tend to take a dive every now and then but positive thinking like those from the likes of Rob and many others is all that's needed to change things around. Best wishes for a successful business and strong family. We have a (almost) 3 year old and my heart goes out to you as well.
!
LCM

Not necessarily...I use MO and LT to hide titanium abutments all the time. Did one yesterday matter of fact, great work on that abutment Mr. Wilson. If you have at least 1.5mm reduction it isn't a problem at all, LT, MO, and HO all mask out those dark stumps. It's when you don't have the reduction and/or using HT, Impulse, Empress where you have to really worry about the stump. I've posted clinical photo's before on here somewhere.

 

[Al.]

I was mistaken, this was only a match to a single 3-D shade, 2M1 with a stump shade of ND3. According to the conversion table that I have it is a 50/50 mix of A1 and D2. So I pressed it in LTA1 and used the D-shade stain to match it to the tab. We typically press our full contour molars in the LT ingots. If the restoration is anything other than a full contour (Inlays, onlays, 3/4 crowns, etc.) we use the HT ingots. It has worked pretty well for us so far.

I also realize that I may have come across a bit like the new guy fishing for a compliment with this post. The fact is that my business partner and I are new lab owners and have only been in business for about eight months. I left a very stable job at an established lab and, with a growing family needing me to have more flexible working hours, decided to open my own place. After several months of marketing every day and paying a visit to nearly every dentist in my area, the work was still not coming in. ‘Failed Business’ became the words that loomed larger with every passing day that yielded no cases coming into the lab. Just when my business partner and I were about to close the doors, sell the assets, and find employment at the local mega-lab, we got some encouraging exchanges from Rob (TheLabGuy) who shared his personal experience of opening his lab and the doubt and uncertainty that a business faces in its infancy. His words encouraged us and we decided to press on for another month.

In February we picked up a big account. Since then we have picked up some minor ones that are growing larger with each case we deliver. The crown I posted a picture of was not meant to be me beating my own chest or to show off my skills. To us, more than anything else, it represents a triumph over what looked like certain collapse. Over the last few months we have used this forum (under my business partner’s screen name) to help with many issues that have popped up (short presses, cracked rings, etc.). Without the wisdom gained from the collective knowledge on this forum, it would not have been possible. Thanks to all of you for taking time to help others out.

P.S. I also hate it when a company places a crown on a piece of black velvet and shows it off in a magazine without any photos of it in the mouth. So, from that standpoint, I’m guilty as charged. If I can get some pics of the crown after it is seated, I’ll post them.

Wow great story thanks for sharing. The moral is persistance.

For alot of Drs the exact shade for press and stain posteriors dosent matter just as long as it is close.

Ive found that most (not all) press and stain LT crowns look waaaay to opaque in the mouth esp in lighter shades.
No matter how much stain I put on them and how beautiful they look on the model they usually look chalky compared to natural teeth.

Im with Rob for posteriors I go lighter and use HT for molars then stain color on the gin 1/2.

If I have to mask out and for picky Drs I go full contour then scoup out the facial and stain and layer the facial only.

Heres 2 crowns (#3 & 4) B1 full contour but layered on the facial only. Leaving it full contour to the buccal cusp tips.

It blends in nice on the facial.



Here on the occlusal it has the look I usually see with LT ingots. The stain usually is just like putting a gold nose ring on a pig.

 

[Al.]

Here is an A1 HT I dont have the facial view.

Press and stain.

 

[paulg100]

yeah great story and good luck!

Ive scrapped doing cut back veneers and gone back to full contour, even with all the different options with emax, you just cant beat fully layered. Maybe that will change when the new polychromatic ingots finally come out.

Which is fine providing the clients paying for the xtra work

 

[Treasurediver]

Thanks for the good advice, TheLabGuy. We hit 96 dentists last week and came back with three new accounts that are giving us a try. We also took our biggest account and her entire staff out to lunch (It's nice to have some money in the bank now) I have personally seen three big labs implode due to poor business/marketing skills coupled with sagging quality.

Al., beautiful work!! The opacity of the e.max is something else that we struggle with too. One of our clients doesn't have any interest in taking stump shades, so we use LT ingots just in case the stump is dark. The others depends on the stump shade for selection.

Another one we did is a 14 unit U/L anterior (+ 2 first bicuspids) case that I think looks too opaque, but dentist was happy and the patient actually sent us a thank-you note, which was a first for me. If you all promise not to laugh too hard, I would love to post the before/after pics and hear some constructive criticism. My mother-in-law is getting ready to have a similiar case and you know I have to do that one right. My marriage probably depends on it

 

[paulg100]

What technique did you use for the anteriors, stain, cut back or fully layer?

 

[Treasurediver]

What technique did you use for the anteriors, stain, cut back or fully layer?

We cut them back and added just a little bit of incisal. The case ended up being a mix of veneers, 3/4 crowns, and full crowns in random orders not to mention it was on two different anterior models. We would have liked to cut back more to allow for more incisal, but the veneers (I think the veneers were # 7, 9, 10, 27, 25) didn't allow for much cut back. The lady wanted them to "Be very white" Enough yappin' here are the pics:

Before:




After:

Dr. was happy (especially with zero adjustments),patient was happy, but we thought it looked too opaque and chalky. She's coming back later this year for the posterior teeth to be crowned (Backwards, I know, but she wanted the anterior first). Any suggestions?

 

[paulg100]

Id use monolithic HT emax for the posteriors and go 1 shade lighter then the required shade.

Not sure how old this case but i reckon the newer Opal or value ingots might have worked better for the veneers.

Anterior LT's without full layering look lifeless like you say.

 

[Al.]

I dont really think they look opaque.
What ingot did you use?

 

[rkm rdt]

They look pretty good to me however you can always "warm" the necks of the canines and bicuspids to make the transition to the posterior shade.......then again I get raked over the coals when I post pics

 

[rkm rdt]

See?...watch!

 

[Treasurediver]

This case was done in Feb. It was actually the third case we got from that big account I mentioned earlier, talk about jumping in headfirst! We pressed it in LTB1. I am curious about the opal ingots. What is a typical reason for their use?