Clon3D

[shane williams]

I was in California a few years ago at the CAD/CAM synposium and one of the speakers adn exibitors was Clon3D. I was wondering if anyone has ever heard or had experince with this inter oral scanning system. Some of are Dr are looking at Itero and from what I remember is that Clon3D is very lightwieght, doesn't use opaque powder, and best for dr's is that you don't have to buy it straight out. I think they run some kind of rent/own kind of promotion, but that was a few years ago.

And if not these two systems what should we be telling dr's to invest in, COS, E4D?????

I'm not 100% sold on this technology. Sounds good but once you start adding up all the costs for a lab the price of a model is rediculous!! Not to mention you pay a fee(I believe Itero has three levels of involvement). So lets say you have 100 dentists, and one buys an Itero. You pay a fee, to design margins and then a crown digitally I believe is like $3000, then pay like $20+(not sure on that) to get a model. I'm no rocket scientist but that seems awfully expensive when I compare it to pouring a model and that cost is closer to $10!!

Maybe it's just me I don't know, someone on here will either convince me to come to the dark side, or validate my opinion!!

Let the debate begin!!

 

[shane williams]

Also if Itero is a closed system and the scan files go directly to Itero, wouldn't be benificial to go with a system that is open like Clon3D. Then I could send it to oh I don't know anything that prints or mills models!! I have read peoples opinion on here about Objet and how they generally seem to like it. Wouldn't that make a good pairing? Like I said not 100% sold yet just trying to get the creative juices flowing

 

[BobCDT]

Also if Itero is a closed system and the scan files go directly to Itero, wouldn't be benificial to go with a system that is open like Clon3D. Then I could send it to oh I don't know anything that prints or mills models!! I have read peoples opinion on here about Objet and how they generally seem to like it. Wouldn't that make a good pairing? Like I said not 100% sold yet just trying to get the creative juices flowing

Great idea, conceptually, but Clone 3D is about two years late to original market release date. I don't have any new info but i wouldn't hold my breath waiting for it to come to market.
I was one of several labs owners to give a $1000 deposit to become a Clone 3D distributor and the company never even provides updates. I know Gary must be really busy. But, what does it take to keep interested distributors informed. Maybe an email a couple of time a year?
Bob

Bob

 

[paulg100]

Correct me if im wrong but isnt this the scanner/or very similar rebranded?

Zfx IntraScan | Zfx Dental - Zahn success formula

 

[Gru]

Does anyone know if Zfx is available in the USA?

 

[JayH]

Those MHT's are all over the place, or were. Distribution was diluted and they never seemed to get to a salable product, for whatever reason.

aTron solved one of the barriers to adoption at least. Their business model is a little difficult though.

iTero seems to be running right along now that they have been bought by Invisalign.

COS is being re-released.

IOS is now being marketed to labs, rather than doctors.

Red-CAM/Blu-CAM and you're working in the Sirona space.

 

[Labwa]

aTron solved one of the barriers to adoption at least. Their business model is a little difficult though.

In what way? I dont know much about these but they look promising on the size side of things.

 

[JayH]

In what way? I dont know much about these but they look promising on the size side of things.

My impression (pun intended) is that the two major barriers to adoption have been size of camera and cost (structure).

 

[CoolHandLuke]

itero to me works quite well. they are a product that has noticeable quality, superior to many 3d systems out there. the fee to design margins really is only beneficial to the in-house laboratory; the model fee i do not see to be too expensive in any way.

itero isnt a closed system; labs with the review station can export scans and restoration orders from itero into 3shape, CIL, dental wings, straumann and more.

what i like about the itero is more the features of the software, to allow the dentist to look at his scan, analyze it in detail (shape of shoulders, clarity of margins, distance to antagonist) all a mouseclick away. it has helped some of my dentists to be better prep designers, and has made some much better at giving me clear margins.

i can't speak to Clon3d directly about their system so i dont know what kind of operational features come with the software.

that said, there are two things i don't like about the itero - 1. built in network. if they would let you save to a disk or save to a zip file, or even share patient scans on a website and email out the download links, it would be great and i wouldnt need a dedicated lab review station and the docs wouldnt need extra internet lines. 2. using the mouse. ugh. whoever designed this system should be strung up by the tendons in the palm of his hand, over a pot of boiling boogers taken from illiterate children. this sucks.

 

[lcmlabforum]

What is wrong with the mouse? You prefer a touchpen/stylus-based system?
LCM

 

[shane williams]

itero to me works quite well. they are a product that has noticeable quality, superior to many 3d systems out there. the fee to design margins really is only beneficial to the in-house laboratory; the model fee i do not see to be too expensive in any way.

itero isnt a closed system; labs with the review station can export scans and restoration orders from itero into 3shape, CIL, dental wings, straumann and more.

what i like about the itero is more the features of the software, to allow the dentist to look at his scan, analyze it in detail (shape of shoulders, clarity of margins, distance to antagonist) all a mouseclick away. it has helped some of my dentists to be better prep designers, and has made some much better at giving me clear margins.

i can't speak to Clon3d directly about their system so i dont know what kind of operational features come with the software.

that said, there are two things i don't like about the itero - 1. built in network. if they would let you save to a disk or save to a zip file, or even share patient scans on a website and email out the download links, it would be great and i wouldnt need a dedicated lab review station and the docs wouldnt need extra internet lines. 2. using the mouse. ugh. whoever designed this system should be strung up by the tendons in the palm of his hand, over a pot of boiling boogers taken from illiterate children. this sucks.

when I said closed I mean the models go directly to Itero. I understand you can import design files to create the crown, but paying $30+ for a model(are Straumann rep just faxed over a sheet. the second level is $21 for basic model, $2 for die, $5 shipping, and $5 additional fee) I'm trying to think of a way where you can recieve a file create the model and coping send the model to a printer like and Objet and then print or in my case mill a crown.

I was in talks with Objet about a 1 1/2 years ago and the model they wanted to sell us was around $30,000. Intial cost is a bit high but if I can print models at a lower fee than $30 then WINNING!!(said in a Charlie Sheen voice)

 

[CoolHandLuke]

the little box that ticks to export iDe will let you export model files as .stl (this is the 3shape output mode),from there import .stl into your printer software and print your models.

can't be that hard. an in-house printer combined with in-house design and you should be ready to print a wax/pmma model from the get-go, and before it finished printing your designer should be able to design the restorations that go with it and send them also to the printer; a combined turnaround time of less than an hour.

is there no way to talk to itero to get them to discard any files sent?

 

[paulg100]

"What is wrong with the mouse? You prefer a touchpen/stylus-based system?
LCM"

no these

3Dconnexion : 3Dconnexion Shop

 

[CoolHandLuke]

"What is wrong with the mouse? You prefer a touchpen/stylus-based system?
LCM"

no these

3Dconnexion : 3Dconnexion Shop

actually that mouse is incompatible with the iTero system, and the Laserdenta system. but you're both wrong; i use the standard 3button mouse, but navigating the interface with this mouse is extremely hard to wrap one's head around. very easy to misclick and throw your margin out the window. right button should be to rotate the model, not mousewheel. right+left should pan, not mwheel+right. left click is almost never used.

a stylus system would be REALLY hard to use in iTero, as normally the wheel is on the pad so you'd need to use both hands to manipulate anything.

 

[YMS96]

the little box that ticks to export iDe will let you export model files as .stl (this is the 3shape output mode),from there import .stl into your printer software and print your models.

can't be that hard. an in-house printer combined with in-house design and you should be ready to print a wax/pmma model from the get-go, and before it finished printing your designer should be able to design the restorations that go with it and send them also to the printer; a combined turnaround time of less than an hour.

is there no way to talk to itero to get them to discard any files sent?

Exactly, import the scans into 3Shape and use Model Builder to build your models and send them to anyone with a printer. You aren't forced to buy the models from iTero.

 

[eyeloveteeth]

We've been milling iTero like models for a while now - (sorry. NDA forces me to be silent about company).

We like the itero for how it looks. CEREC AC is a great idea, but who wants to be locked into just 4.0?

I heard that the Trios is picking up some steam over in EU

 

[shane williams]

We've been milling iTero like models for a while now - (sorry. NDA forces me to be silent about company).

We like the itero for how it looks. CEREC AC is a great idea, but who wants to be locked into just 4.0?

I heard that the Trios is picking up some steam over in EU

So I'm guessing you probably have to be the partner lab where you select the margin or can you do that on the option where the Dr selects the margin but you get the digital file for doing the crown?

 

[eyeloveteeth]

Actually the way the itero files work - you can port the margins the doctor set. But it's always good to double check.

 

[[email protected]]

Dear friends: I have an Itero and it's a steaming pile of cowdung! In addition to a lab fee I get a $25 scan fee and get to trip at the finish line when the crown or crowns don't fit whic is the majority of the time. Most puzzling is its inability to handle exposed margins Above the tissue. I Am Not Impressed. I thought I would be able to save money on impression material and get a superior digital product. Not even close. I'm still paying for it yet I hardly ever reach for since it sucks. Like The Shadevision, it's the Emperor's New Clothes. I wouldn't mind the bulkiness if it worked. Worst part is I can see the margins on the screen but it's not what I get. I use cord, diode laser and expasyl--sometimes all three. The Only good thing is that in preparing soft tissue for it, my retraction has gotten really good at it and rarely miss with with polyvinyl now, with I could say the same for the Itero.:0(

 

[CatamountRob]

Dear friends: I have an Itero and it's a steaming pile of cowdung! In addition to a lab fee I get a $25 scan fee and get to trip at the finish line when the crown or crowns don't fit whic is the majority of the time. Most puzzling is its inability to handle exposed margins Above the tissue. I Am Not Impressed. I thought I would be able to save money on impression material and get a superior digital product. Not even close. I'm still paying for it yet I hardly ever reach for since it sucks. Like The Shadevision, it's the Emperor's New Clothes. I wouldn't mind the bulkiness if it worked. Worst part is I can see the margins on the screen but it's not what I get. I use cord, diode laser and expasyl--sometimes all three. The Only good thing is that in preparing soft tissue for it, my retraction has gotten really good at it and rarely miss with with polyvinyl now, with I could say the same for the Itero.:0(

Interesting first post. So, tell us what you REALLY think of Itero.