Anyone familiar with the gnathological technique for set ups?

[charles hallam cdt]

I have seen one case set up this way and it looked home made. Curious if this a device or something this dr and other lab came up with

 

[GarryB]

I have seen one case set up this way and it looked home made. Curious if this a device or something this dr and other lab came up with

Don't think its a home made thing. A tech I used to know built his business around this technique but its not my field so can't say anymore.

 

[charles hallam cdt]

I can't find device. Might help if I knew what I was looking for. Lol

 

[kcdt]

I need some definition of terms. Gnathology as well as Pankey/Mann occlusal schemes are really oriented towards fixed dentition,I.e.,mutually protected occlusion, or tripod posterior contacts...
Most of that doesn't transfer to removable prosthetics.

Like I said can you elaborate on the term?

 

[charles hallam cdt]

I know gnathology is the study of facial muscle. So I am also trying to figure out how dr incorporates this his dentures. Dr says it helps to line up the max/mand jaw but I thought that's what face bows were for. I wish I would have taken a pic to show you more.

 

[JMN]

I know gnathology is the study of facial muscle. So I am also trying to figure out how dr incorporates this his dentures. Dr says it helps to line up the max/mand jaw but I thought that's what face bows were for. I wish I would have taken a pic to show you more.

Not quite a pure guess, but without more info I'm thinking that the Japanese were doing something like a facebow + neutral zone methods and were using this as a shorthand translation/term for the procedure. Too little time to search right now to verify my thought before posting like I usually will, but that's where I'd start searching.

 

[kcdt]

Not quite a pure guess, but without more info I'm thinking that the Japanese were doing something like a facebow + neutral zone methods and were using this as a shorthand translation/term for the procedure. Too little time to search right now to verify my thought before posting like I usually will, but that's where I'd start searching.

I'm fully versed in Massad's NZ approach.
If you search in removable forums you'll find a slide dump I did over two threads a couple years back.

 

[JMN]

I'm fully versed in Massad's NZ approach.
If you search in removable forums you'll find a slide dump I did over two threads a couple years back.

Oh yeah, now I remeber that.

I was thinking of something else I read on an abstract though. Like I said, not quite a pure guess. But close.

 

[kcdt]

Oh yeah, now I remeber that.

I was thinking of something else I read on an abstract though. Like I said, not quite a pure guess. But close.

http://dentallabnetwork.com/forums/threads/neutral-zone-massad-technique.21261/

 

[charles hallam cdt]

http://dentallabnetwork.com/forums/threads/neutral-zone-massad-technique.21261/

Very interesting reading of which I will take more time tonight to study it farther. However I'm getting the feeling I'm in over my head because as you say it takes lots of practice and knowledge of this technique. If I'm lucky maybe the dr will spend some time educating me. Thank you for your help KCDT

 

[zero_zero]

I have seen one case set up this way and it looked home made. Curious if this a device or something this dr and other lab came up with

Ivoclar used to sell an articulator called Gnathomat...not sure what purpose did serve, perhaps @Patrick Coon can chime in ?

 

[JMN]

Ivoclar used to sell an articulator called Gnathomat...not sure what purpose did serve, perhaps @Patrick Coon can chime in ?
View attachment 27393

Looks like a picture from a wresting match in a world of sentient materials.

 

[charles hallam cdt]

Ivoclar used to sell an articulator called Gnathomat...not sure what purpose did serve, perhaps @Patrick Coon can chime in ?
View attachment 27393

I think it's trying to crawl away!!

 

[Patrick Coon]

Ivoclar used to sell an articulator called Gnathomat...not sure what purpose did serve, perhaps @Patrick Coon can chime in ?
View attachment 27393

Sorry guys, been prepping the house.

As for this piece of instrumentation, I'm not familiar with it. This has not been available for a while. When I get a chance, I'll ask my denture guru, Don Yancey, about it.

Sent from my SM-G935V using Tapatalk

 

[grantoz]

Dr bill mchorris was the gnathology guy it was all about relaxed muscle position canine disclussion lingualised set ups it was a a bit of a precurser to lvi etc he loved gold crowns the more the better .it was a pretty solid system i went to a few of his lectures in the early 90s he wasnt young then probably 70 years old nice guy good speaker.i had quite a few clients that wwere using his theories and techniques with great success.when i did lvi years later i said oh this is like mchorris they got quite defensive and then spent hours trying to point out the differences there wasnt a whole lot of difference just a few more machines and lingo.

 

[dmonwaxa]

To the best of my knowledge the Gnathological techniques are used predominantly for fixed
FMRs. To achieve the same with complete dentures one would have to create and convert the occlusal scheme of the prosthetic teeth. No prosthetic denture teeth I know of provides the stability and accuracy that's required with this approach. We're talking about a series of occlusal points each providing a specific function based on its location. Ex: closure stops... Equalizers.... etc...

Maybe LCM can chime in here.

 

[grantoz]

i saw some of bill mchorris's work for dentures he still used canine disclusion and gold posteriors thats when he lost me.

 

[charles hallam cdt]

After reading all your response I'm thinking I'm not going to spend any time focusing on it. The dr has been very pleased with the dentures he's received, so why change something that is working. Thanks again for all your input still very informative. At least I learned something.

 

[JMN]

After reading all your response I'm thinking I'm not going to spend any time focusing on it. The dr has been very pleased with the dentures he's received, so why change something that is working. Thanks again for all your input still very informative. At least I learned something.

Good plan. If docs can't express their wants, how would either of you be graded on your efforts as you attempt to approach achieving it.

 

[kcdt]

I would that in my entire career, I've never seen canine disclusion do anything but destabilize a removable denture.

I also note that for some reason a lot of dentists can't/don't not grasp the different requirement for successful occlusion in removable vs fixed/natural.