Abutment designing through Rhino software

[nik1618kin]

I have heard that it's quite easy to design abutments using Rhino software. What is the process?

 

[YMS96]

Ask the person you heard that from, lol. Rhino isn't exactly 'easy', it has a steep learning curve but that's because it's real cad software. It would be much easier to use 3Shape or exocad or something like that to do abutments (I use Rhino everyday btw).

 

[Marcusthegladiator CDT]

Easy? NO! I would imagine it would take 10 times longer to use rhino to design, anything. As opposed to a dedicated dental designer. Like 3shape.
Basically, it can be done. But it would require expert knowledge of rhino.

 

[ksmksam]

abutments cant be desgined buy dental cad so you must use manufacurer cad desgin like rhino mastercam artcam solidworks
i loking to degined it and milled it in zircon
and i know some labs which they use cadcam they buy desgined abutments cad for many company

 

[DMC]

.
???

Google translator didn't do you justice on that one. LOL

MasterCAM is not CAD. It is CAM. Rhino is also not CAM..it is CAD. Maybe it is too late/early in the day for you to think straight?

Exocad is Dental CAD that can design Abutments and bars. I have no idea what you are trying to say, if anything at all?

 

[Labwa]

I am in the process of designing abutment libraries for implant bridges in rhino, seeing they are not easy to find.
its not too hard to work out if you have basic "real CAD" experience.
These will be titanium inserts. The files will be able to be imported into 3shape and sit into the milled frames like most of the other single abutment inserts.
I'll get these ones printed to check the design before i get them lathed.
This design probably took 15 minutes for the replace select. i wanted to keep them shorter compared to the stock single ones but it looks like ill have to increase the height. I will also most likely change the design to have 1 flat side and possibly play with the size of the internal implant interface. I have made it wider than the nobel biocare bridge ucla because i hate that movement you get when you go to screw them down.
Trial and error i guess. mind you its not rocket science. ive seen some pretty shtty designs i've paid good money for.
Another advantage to designing these myself is we will be able to use all the real screws from the implant companies
(this is a rough trial)

 

[Labwa]

If that was what your trying to ask about...

 

[nik1618kin]

Ask the person you heard that from, lol. Rhino isn't exactly 'easy', it has a steep learning curve but that's because it's real cad software. It would be much easier to use 3Shape or exocad or something like that to do abutments (I use Rhino everyday btw).

I've already a 3shape (Abutment Designer software) but the problem remains the same; no abutment library in order to design one-piece abutment. At the time I'm able to do only 2-pieces abutments(zirconia or Cocr glued on a titanium base). But this technique is still inconvinient. If you need to correct an implant angle with a 30 degrees abutment you have to individualize the titanium base before. And that's when the whole process becomes a mess. That's why I've mentioned abutment designing through Rhino.
Any suggestion for abutment digital library for 3shape?

 

[DMC]

Contact Arnie on this site. He has a Sweeeeet DMG in Pennsylvania.

He will hook you up with the correct library, but fixing 3shape functions s another thing.

Go buy Exocad! LOL

 

[paulg100]

just remember 4mm is the minimum height recommended for cohesive cementation.

that is on a regular tooth, the forces on these inserts would probably be higher.

If your using a metal primer and an adhesive resin to cement the custom top to the insert maybe this would offset this?

Also theres probably a reason why companies are not offering tapered inserts at this time, again a strength issue?

Your on a big R&D project here. I hope if your gonna start using these parts on real patients you know what your getting into....?

all the same its very neat :high5:

 

[Labwa]

Yeah i wouldnt go below 4mm and would probably stick to about 4.5 - 5
Using multilink implant from ivoclar and priming it should stick.
Hey ive seen nobel and astra abutments break....if anything these should be stronger.
This is closer to what the finished inserts would look like.

 

[CoolHandLuke]

i wouldnt go completely square, Labwa. from the experience i have with Laserdenta and 3shape i'd say those corners won't work for you.

if i were you i would look at a double/triple triangle " ^ ^ " pattern. it scans easier, and is more useful when designing implant-to-implant 3 unit bridges with odd draw angles. (i get those more than i get normal insertion angles)

 

[DentalAxess]

just remember 4mm is the minimum height recommended for cohesive cementation.

that is on a regular tooth, the forces on these inserts would probably be higher.

If your using a metal primer and an adhesive resin to cement the custom top to the insert maybe this would offset this?

Also theres probably a reason why companies are not offering tapered inserts at this time, again a strength issue?

Your on a big R&D project here. I hope if your gonna start using these parts on real patients you know what your getting into....?

all the same its very neat :high5:

And let's not forget the regulatory aspects on this, looking at the other Ti-inserts available in the market they are generally classified as a Class 2A device and as such require registration by a regulatory body. I doubt you can classify this as a patient specific design as with customized abutments (where the screw, insert and material require approval, but not the design).

 

[Labwa]

Yeah rounding those sharp edges will be the way to do it i think. They wont be scanned though so im not worried about that.
I understand the classification issue but some of the others i've seen are pretty average. not that has any impact on classification.
Do you know where i can get non engaging inserts with files to import them into 3shape then DentalAxess?

 

[ksmksam]

.
???

Google translator didn't do you justice on that one. LOL

MasterCAM is not CAD. It is CAM. Rhino is also not CAM..it is CAD. Maybe it is too late/early in the day for you to think straight?

Exocad is Dental CAD that can design Abutments and bars. I have no idea what you are trying to say, if anything at all?

i use master cam as cad design before this time they have many version so I dont know what you are talking about it
about 3 shape i don't have much experience but when i say its not cad design I was talking about abutment and general design not about teeth design or spcial function for dental application

 

[YMS96]

.


MasterCAM is not CAD. It is CAM. Rhino is also not CAM..it is CAD. Maybe it is too late/early in the day for you to think straight?

MasterCAM does have CAD design tools.