What scanner should I start with? New lab.

Heidi

Heidi

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Starting a new lab, want to start off right. Which scanner would you all recommend a new lab with a modest startup budget choose, and why? Looking to do a bit of implant work using several systems. And of course zirconia.
 
Labwa

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I would go with a 3shape scanner. Even if you can get hold of a second hand d700.They're great to start on. just make sure you are linked up with a couple of good manufacturers and don't get locked in to 1 manufacturer because of a discounted scanner.
 
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Hello!

For example Dental wings 3series is one of the cheapest, but it depend where you are located, since 4.0 release many bugs are gone and workflows are brand new and simple.
I personally use it every day

With a good training you will be able to increase your production with every system, DW, 3shape,exocad for example, are providing implant module, including zirconia of course

If you are really looking for cheap scanner, obviously dental wings is the solution
 
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I started on Cynovad...;)
 
CoolHandLuke

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if you don't mind Gru i am going to paste part of our conversation in that old thread. no, you know what i am going to paste it here and save headaches.

when it comes to knowing the intricacies of the [3shape] system i am a self-taught wizard. i like being that guy. but when it comes to trying to sell the system or support somebody who only cares about pricetags and streamlining the core process and purposely spend less time in the cad because they want to spend more time on the bench to finish their products by hand... that irritates me like you wouldnt believe.

the most common 3shape v exocad talking point is price. that's wrong. thats very wrong. with 3shape your business makes 4000 dollars less per year - that is an insignificant impact. completely. initially yes the cost is daunting but 4000 per year amounts to like 10 dollars per working day. you spend more money on lunch than that. a case of beer costs more than that.

if you find the initial cost of 3shape high, i can't disagree with you. but the comparison of software should never come down to price, if this is a business. the point of a business is to make more than the cost of the tools. if you cant make more than 10 dollars per day for a year, i have no support that can help.

the point of software is function. if the only hurdle you cross is price, then function really must mean nothing. this to me means the technician isnt really thinking about the tech. if that is the case then the technician probably would appreciate something easy to use; simple, refined, smart software.

these are the people that need 3shape but end up buying exocad.

i can't teach these people because they don't talk tech, only pricetags and bottom lines.

so i am glad i am not a salesman when i talk to these people.
 
Gru

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CHL, you are free to post as you will! Your help has been indispensable this past year. I admire that you are willing to educate us even when there's no obvious way you will profit on it. My (tortilla) hat's off to you!

Nice avatar! LOL.
 
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CoolHandLuke

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1342807264266680946082.jpeg
 
2thm8kr

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if you don't mind Gru i am going to paste part of our conversation in that old thread. no, you know what i am going to paste it here and save headaches.

when it comes to knowing the intricacies of the [3shape] system i am a self-taught wizard. i like being that guy. but when it comes to trying to sell the system or support somebody who only cares about pricetags and streamlining the core process and purposely spend less time in the cad because they want to spend more time on the bench to finish their products by hand... that irritates me like you wouldnt believe.

the most common 3shape v exocad talking point is price. that's wrong. thats very wrong. with 3shape your business makes 4000 dollars less per year - that is an insignificant impact. completely. initially yes the cost is daunting but 4000 per year amounts to like 10 dollars per working day. you spend more money on lunch than that. a case of beer costs more than that.

if you find the initial cost of 3shape high, i can't disagree with you. but the comparison of software should never come down to price, if this is a business. the point of a business is to make more than the cost of the tools. if you cant make more than 10 dollars per day for a year, i have no support that can help.

the point of software is function. if the only hurdle you cross is price, then function really must mean nothing. this to me means the technician isnt really thinking about the tech. if that is the case then the technician probably would appreciate something easy to use; simple, refined, smart software.

these are the people that need 3shape but end up buying exocad.

i can't teach these people because they don't talk tech, only pricetags and bottom lines.

so i am glad i am not a salesman when i talk to these people.


Luke,

I mostly agree with you. However I chose Exocad partly on price, but I like the openness of the software. Both 3Shape and Exocad are great CAD software. I like the fact that I can modify Exocad easily to my needs and I don't get nickled and dimed for everything I want to do with MY data. Exocad is great if you like to solve your own problems. With 3Shape it seems you have to go with 3Shape's solutions or pay another license fee. If you are just starting out with CAD 3Shape is probably the better way to go if you are going to need a lot of hand holding to learn the software. My $.02
 
rkm rdt

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I need all the hand holding I can get...except from that perv usernameAhhhhh
 
Gru

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Luke,

I mostly agree with you. However I chose Exocad partly on price, but I like the openness of the software. Both 3Shape and Exocad are great CAD software. I like the fact that I can modify Exocad easily to my needs and I don't get nickled and dimed for everything I want to do with MY data. Exocad is great if you like to solve your own problems. With 3Shape it seems you have to go with 3Shape's solutions or pay another license fee. If you are just starting out with CAD 3Shape is probably the better way to go if you are going to need a lot of hand holding to learn the software. My $.02

I KNEW someone's $0.02 were missing from that old thread! :D
 
CoolHandLuke

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2th,

while i can see your point, a little ingenuity can go a long way in 3shape. understanding what the system wants to see will let you excersize your problem solving.

for example, using the coping software and some attachments to create a bar (without paying for the bar software),or fixed orthotics, or lots of different things.

its just a longer and more stressful way to do the same thing.

and takes a bit of time to play around and do something interesting.
 
2thm8kr

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2th,

while i can see your point, a little ingenuity can go a long way in 3shape. understanding what the system wants to see will let you excersize your problem solving.

for example, using the coping software and some attachments to create a bar (without paying for the bar software),or fixed orthotics, or lots of different things.

its just a longer and more stressful way to do the same thing.

and takes a bit of time to play around and do something interesting.
Absolutely, we don't disagree on that. Can you make a custom implant library without jumping through a bunch of hoops and paying to have the privilege to do so?
 
CoolHandLuke

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theres many kinds of ways a library can be custom - do you mean custom in the sense the abutments are custom, or custom as in analogs and scan bodies from differing companies switched around in the implant software ?

custom abutments without the implant module... havent used this part of my brain in a while... as long as you are doing hybrids then yes. it would take a lot of time but you could custom make the piece over the base using the coping software and a lot of sculpting.

full implants is another story.
 
2thm8kr

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Solid Ti abutments using a few different manufacturer's stl files.
 
CoolHandLuke

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well that is another story. at minimum you will have to consider how you will mill them - which will determine how you can design them.

in dentmill you need to have the interface premilled, and the interface of the stl removed, which makes design actually kinda easy; considering theres no need for a base in the stl data you could design something to interface with the analog on the scan model, like a healing cap, and work from a fixed plane upwards.

if you intend on milling ti on a haas, milling the full interface, you'll need to pay for the implant module, no getting around that. not that i can noodle without more practice.

well, unless you do a physical waxup using something like a burnout cap, that interfaces with the model correctly.

scan the waxup in its fully sprued orientation, add the hole... call it an attachment that cannot be resized (a flick of a control panel setting) and add it to anything... but that's already too much work. far faster to use the implant tools.
 
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Starting a new lab, want to start off right. Which scanner would you all recommend a new lab with a modest startup budget choose, and why? Looking to do a bit of implant work using several systems. And of course zirconia.

3shape is what I use and Love the software. Just do your homework and find a distributor that will BE there for you when you need help. IF you find it difficult to get in touch with your rep before the sale, it will only get worse after. Ask around for those who have had good response and assistance from their distributor. We scan and design in house and outsource the milling.It is a good business model for us.
 
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