Natural Looking Dentures

[McCall Dentures]

Jewish Elvis, Neil Diamond?

Either that or one of the Jonas brothers?!?

 

[TomZ]

 

[TomZ]

Yeti and Tribos wax

 

[thetoothfarie]

Well I just read this entire thread, pics and all, becouse the thread is titiled:
"Natural Looking Dentures"

What a rollercoaster ride! I loved it. Got a little insite on a couple people I admire. Got to read and see some of the best work from pro's that refuse the title. I got ton's of advice on set-ups and wax-up's.

My disapointment?

You can not make natural looking dentures without selecting the correct teeth for the patient. No, I am not talking about brand or type or even shade.

Years appon years of experiance out there. 10 points to the 1st tech or Dr. that knows what the #1 step in making natural looking dentures.popcorn

 

[TomZ]

I know that I rely on photos of the patient. Certain pictures illustrate what is good and bad about the patients condition. It builds a baseline for selection of a mold that is appropriate for the patient. Experience and research show that arch form has very little to do with mold selection, contrary to the bilge being pushed by certain manufacturers.

One paper in particular showed a study where Drs. were asked to decide if a patient was male or female based on tooth mold and arch form. Although there was a 50/50 chance of being correct, they failed miserably.

 

[thetoothfarie]

Not talking arch form, But you are close.

 

[Kreyer]

Well I just read this entire thread, pics and all, becouse the thread is titiled:
"Natural Looking Dentures"

What a rollercoaster ride! I loved it. Got a little insite on a couple people I admire. Got to read and see some of the best work from pro's that refuse the title. I got ton's of advice on set-ups and wax-up's.

My disapointment?

You can not make natural looking dentures without selecting the correct teeth for the patient. No, I am not talking about brand or type or even shade.

Years appon years of experiance out there. 10 points to the 1st tech or Dr. that knows what the #1 step in making natural looking dentures.popcorn

Interesting question Kim!!

In my opinion there are different ways to answer this. In regards to the first technical step is a model analysis during treatment planning...In regards to the first clinical step is recording an Ala to Ala and Papillameter measurements which will determine placement of teeth in relation to facial mask...But the very first step for me is visualization of the negative space!!

Rob

 

[TomZ]

Hmmm...to visualize anything, negative space and how it exists or how it was previously treated, you gotta have pictures.

 

[thetoothfarie]

tooth selection

How about selecting teeth based on the size and shape of the patient face! You cant go by the shape of the arch, they may have had ortho.
Iam not a CDT, I learned my craft in the back of a dental office while working as a RDA for a Dentist, and lots of books and chair side practice.

All this concern about stippling, and tissue tinting. Do ya all do set-ups so your patient has a gummy smile? Don't get me wrong I used Lucitone and did the shading. I even custom stained porc. teeth.

If I am wrong or am missing something.....educate me, Iam listening.popcorn

I am not a leader in the industry, I am a artist in my craft.

Have a great holiday. Blessed be.

 

[TomZ]

All this concern about stippling, and tissue tinting. Do ya all do set-ups so your patient has a gummy smile? Don't get me wrong I used Lucitone and did the shading. I even custom stained porc. teeth.


Actually, the comprehensive fabrication approach comes from the "subliminal acceptance" mindset. I dont only fabricate for what shows, but cater to the patients psyche of acceptance as well.

Most Patients want an overall change, especially when the promise of something deemed better than average is paid for.
The cost of 2, 4, or 6 implants being placed deserves more than a hunk of veined plastic and perfectly placed chicklets.

 

[CYNOSURER]

Actually, the comprehensive fabrication approach comes from the "subliminal acceptance" mindset. I dont only fabricate for what shows, but cater to the patients psyche of acceptance as well.

And don't forget psycho, too.

I had a patient that insisted on a clear palate so no one would know she had a denture when she yawned or laughed. I considered telling her about palatal toning. But, she's had dentures since she was 18 and has had clear palates for 50 years...sometimes you got to know when to back away.

 

[hydent]

Shape of face is a good reference. I have studied a lot of cases and looked at natural dentition and have found that the shape of the face on a lot of people doesn't always correlate with the shape of their teeth. I have found that different nationalities of people have different characteristics smaller laterals, large centrals ,tapering teeth etc. Europeans tend to have small laterals and Hispanics tend to have tapering teeth and so on. If your like a lot of us in the us your a Heinz 57 like myself so this isn't always reliable either. You did bring up a good topic for discussion though that interestingly wasn't brought up until page 15. I think for the most part it's fair to assume that everyone participating knows how to pick teeth out for a case (with a little bit of variance) and obviously we/they are doing something right. Having a photograph or multiple is key to really adding the personal touch to any case as Tom mentioned. It's really too bad with todays technology that it hasn't became more mainstream and taught in dental schools. I mean we have machines that do everything now days , why cant we get a picture or two with every case, it's not 1950 anymore.

 

[thetoothfarie]

Denture Senei

Wow Hydent! I just gingled your bells.

Iam so happy to find another tech to add to my list of people to "lurk'

As an assistant, I saw what made a difference in what Dr.s call 'patient acceptance'. That is why I put ruggi(sp) in all immediate dentures from day 1.
Assisting chairside I saw what Dr.s liked, and that was happy patients. For some (not all {Hi John}) the denture could look like crap, but if the patient was happy, the Dr. was happy. I have also seen the happiest of patients leave with a beautifully made and fitting set of dentures and come back the next day cryin' cuz one person said the wrong thing or asked the wrong thing of the patient! But I get off subject.

Hydent you nailed it! A picture can tell a 1,000 words in our profesion. I went with the size and the shape of the face when available to select the shape.
I used nationality and sex (be nice!) to determin the set up.

Please know I know you guys know your 5hit. One of you is the 5hit. Thats why I stay here. Good people and good techs. Just need more people that enjoy the light. luv ya Tim.:kiss:

Blessed be to all of you, and have a :rock::rock: weekend!

 

[hydent]

You can jingle my bells any time Tooth Farie

 

[Sanhlabo]

Wow Hydent! I just gingled your bells.

Iam so happy to find another tech to add to my list of people to "lurk'

As an assistant, I saw what made a difference in what Dr.s call 'patient acceptance'. That is why I put ruggi(sp) in all immediate dentures from day 1.
Assisting chairside I saw what Dr.s liked, and that was happy patients. For some (not all {Hi John}) the denture could look like crap, but if the patient was happy, the Dr. was happy. I have also seen the happiest of patients leave with a beautifully made and fitting set of dentures and come back the next day cryin' cuz one person said the wrong thing or asked the wrong thing of the patient! But I get off subject.

Hydent you nailed it! A picture can tell a 1,000 words in our profesion. I went with the size and the shape of the face when available to select the shape.
I used nationality and sex (be nice!) to determin the set up.

Please know I know you guys know your 5hit. One of you is the 5hit. Thats why I stay here. Good people and good techs. Just need more people that enjoy the light. luv ya Tim.:kiss:

Blessed be to all of you, and have a :rock::rock: weekend!

DearKim,
You are at the same angle with me on seeing the issue.I do agree with what you have mentioned,patient acceptance.,the real denture success for a dental clinic.If the patient accept the denture with a big big grin and real shinning happiness on the face,you can lit the fire crackers instantly.Does the natural looking or life like dentures more important than Denture Picaso made master pieces?One need to have a look at the patient's face and size of mouth ,form of gums ,how he or she smile,what color of teeth he/she prefer, age,race,chewing habits,etc:.Then you should think of ways to ,how could I make him/her more good looking with my dentures on.Do that with artist's mind .Not with technologist's.It is when you are admired by the dentist,not even dare to touch up your work at try ins.Wishing all my net pals called Denture Gurus.

 

[droberts]

Aesthetic results

Here is a photo of a case I fabricated in my lab. Whether its a denture or an implant related case, I characterize them all. Using Fricke
tinting acrylic with Ivocap injection.

Hopefully the image appears. If not, your are welcome to view my website
at Hawkeye Dental Studio - Dental Iowa Cedar Rapids Iowa.

 

[JohnWilson]

Hi Danny,

I went to your website and browsed some of you work its very impressive.

I also find it sad how poorly place a few of those implant cases were. There was definitely some magic making those restorations. Hopefully this wasn't from one of those "Prosthodontists" you were referencing earlier.

In any event, its good to have another talented tech sharing here, it always great to see others that are excited about doing more than just clinically acceptable.

Take care

 

[hydent]

Looks like Danny might know a thing or two about a thing or two.

 

[TomZ]

Dannys a good dude. He cant place implants as good as Wilson, but then hes a technician and not an oral surgeon/technician.

LOL

 

[JohnWilson]

With all the CE I have taken from the Implant manufactures sometimes it feels like I could do a better job than some Thanks for the KUDOS Tom seems you softening up is your old age. Come on out to Cali Tommy and we will teach you a thing or 10 about implants.

Anyone that is interested in the ALL on 4 technique Nobel Biocare and Sunrise Dental Lab will be presenting 6 hands on courses over the next 4 months. The program will highlight proper treatment planning/case selection along with the fundamentals of CAD/CAM substructures for FMR's. If interested please drop me a PM for more information.