vhf milling machine

[paulg100]

why cant i get excited about this stuff anymore.. oh yeah its because we bought a Sirona Inlab :Cry:

 

[YMS96]

We designed our own tools(3 vs 2 flutes, Higher grade material). You can't really run diamond coat on the vhf, like on Imes(Like Sevan I assume is using) because vhf has the electric difference tool sensor which is not like the more complex one on an Imes so only conductive tools work.

Are you selling these tools???

 

[JohnWilson]

We get way more than 35-40 units per tool, with the new 3 flute tools more than 100. That would add up to serious dollars at the typical tool price since 3 tools are in use on most strategies. One of my milling guys said Jensen told him you had to dedicate a mini to either zirconia or Ultimate, anyone out there hear that. For what it's worth, I do less 5 axis milling because the kerf loss surrounding the units is greatly increases when the a and b axes are going. Only large bridges are done on our 5 axis strategy.

BINGO!

 

[PCDL]

We designed our own tools(3 vs 2 flutes, Higher grade material). You can't really run diamond coat on the vhf, like on Imes(Like Sevan I assume is using) because vhf has the electric difference tool sensor which is not like the more complex one on an Imes so only conductive tools work.

So I am under the impression that you are running a larger mill than the vhf that I have. Overall, for the price of the mill and the price of the burs, I am ok with the lifespan that I am getting. My coping cost, with labor, material, bur cost, and overhead is around $16/unit. Im comfortable with that...

 

[REJ]

We have some sizes for sale probably. For sure we have 2mm and 1mm. I think we also have a few 2.5. We do run big and small machines three are wieland minis. That was what the data was on. I think it matched up with a customer running them through a cadblu flavor of vhf. I'd honestly have to look in the stockroom some of the tools we bought batches of thousands some just hundreds. Would not be comfortable with $16 as a pricepoint but some are. Ours used to be above that a year ago so it can be fixed. I think sub 10 is doable for most labs with the right systems.

 

[PCDL]

I would agree with you that if I was outsourcing to labs (as it seems that you are) I wouldn't be very happy with $16. But, as a part of a finished product, $16 isn't too bad considering a final price of $190/unit. I think that as I get a bit more automated, this will probably come up on the agenda again, so I am going to keep my ears open about these burs!

 

[FMX_DBC]

Hey guys! I was hoping I could get some input on what vacuum or dust collection system people are using with their VHF machines. We just took delivery of one to offset workload from our Wieland 4030 and need to find a proper vacuum for it. Thanks in advance!

 

[Mike2]

i run a Integeral systems vac,seems to do fine. It has been my experience that the machine is sealed to well so no air flow for the vacuum to suck, that sucks! When I turn it on a lot of times the material just shoots to the front. Most of what actually gets sucked up is the very fine dust not the larger particles, may be that it's too much suction???? Any ideas other the fact that there is not enough air pulling through? Thanks in advance!

 

[NicelyMKV]

I used a Zubler V6000. Did the job

 

[JohnWilson]

I will suggest if you work in the area where the mills are that you look for a suction system that uses a filter that is FULLY HEPA COMPLIANT.

I use quatro twin vac, its worked quite well but it will NEVER get everything out of the chamber. I am paranoid about breathing that crap so I have another two air purifiers that recycle the air in the room rather quickly just to be on the safe side

 

[BobCDT]

Thanks Drizzt for advising?? What are you operating now?? Roland sounds good, Except for Scott, everyone else like it. The only advantage I see with VHF over Roland is the spindle is Jager, more solid , at 60,000 rpm vs Roland at 30,000 I don't know what different that makes in reality , but the Jager name is pretty good

Hi Frias, Bob from CAP. We sell both Imes Icore and Roland mills. The Roland mill has a top speed of 30K rpm. However, the fasted milling strategy we use only requires 28K speed. In addition the Roland spindle comes with a two year warranty. We currently are milling full contour screw retained zirconia restorations in the Roland. We have both mills running here at CAP in our milling center. Both provide great results. Our Imes 450i has the wet option for milling CrCo, Titanium and lithium disilicate. Sorry I can't add comparative analysis on the VHF as I don't have one. If you would like to see either or both in action you are more than welcome to come for a visit.

 

[FMX_DBC]

I used a Zubler V6000. Did the job

Is it possible you could help me with the dimensions on the Zubler? My web search didn't yield any info

 

[NicelyMKV]

Is it possible you could help me with the dimensions on the Zubler? My web search didn't yield any info

I will measure it Monday when I get back to work

 

[NicelyMKV]

http://www.zubler.de/files/p_absaug_cadcam_de_121221.pdf

Link to information on the V 6000 vac.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

 

[BobCDT]

As far as tool life/ margin chipping; they are linked of course... The mill records hours of use, not units, and I have been getting 10-12 hrs. Per tool. Roughly that comes out to 35-40 units per tool before I start seeing some chipping. The 2mm tool needs changing the most, occasionally the 1mm, and I have yet to

You should try diamond coated tools. We get 500-700 units from a set. Not sure of the cost. Buy, you will definitely reduce tool cost per unit.

 

[DMC]

We get 300-400+ units from $25 tools from ISI tools. This is the truth.

Gold colored Nitrate? coating. They make Roland tools now. (4mm)

Tell Luisa Scott said, "Hi!". Luisa makes me custom tools for Ti and Cr-Co and other projects.

http://www.isitool.com/files/IDI_tools_for_dental_use.pdf
ISI Precision Machinery Dental


LOVE the price and quality! I find the 1mm tools last very very very long....just like Bob says.
We inspect under high-power microscope to look for folded flutes, and sereated edges, then we toss into the trash.

Maybe we recycle our tools more than I think? It is hard to keep track of how many teeth now?

Scott

 

[FMX_DBC]

John we ended up getting the Quatro also. How did you wire it up to interface with with the mill? I'm being told that the plug for the mill side is 4 wires while the plug on the Quatro side is 8 wires. I'm speaking of the auto on/off control of the vacuum by the mill of course. Thanks!

I will suggest if you work in the area where the mills are that you look for a suction system that uses a filter that is FULLY HEPA COMPLIANT.

I use quatro twin vac, its worked quite well but it will NEVER get everything out of the chamber. I am paranoid about breathing that crap so I have another two air purifiers that recycle the air in the room rather quickly just to be on the safe side

 

[JohnWilson]

Being that the US machine has to be UL listed its not possible to use the on off pulse from the mini. I spoke with the techs at Quatro and they told me there was no way with out really modifying stuff.

We have installed a wall mounted timer for when we mill a full puck and go home at night so the vac doesn't run for 8 hours

Yes I specifically bought the quatro as its compliant with the Euro spec machine but not the stupid ul rated US model. Of course I didn't know this little fact at the time.

 

[Glenn Kennedy]

Being that the US machine has to be UL listed its not possible to use the on off pulse from the mini. I spoke with the techs at Quatro and they told me there was no way with out really modifying stuff.

We have installed a wall mounted timer for when we mill a full puck and go home at night so the vac doesn't run for 8 hours

Yes I specifically bought the quatro as its compliant with the Euro spec machine but not the stupid ul rated US model. Of course I didn't know this little fact at the time.

John,

I am not sure about the VHF port but Quattro offers a cable to connect the Roland DWX-50 so it powers on/off automatically when the spindle goes on and off. If they can do it for the DWX-50 I would figure they could do it for other mills.

Quattro, 514-630-4444, part#AE638, $29. (shipping $20) Quattro air technologies , Quebec, Canada. 514-630-4444

-Glenn

 

[JohnWilson]

Hi Glen,

I spoke with them thinking the same thing but there is something not quite right with this mill from what I was told. Not exactly sure what the reason was but was told it was something to do with getting it UL listed. Its really not a big deal to use the timer once we set it up.