Noblebond

[DentalLabHombre]

Is anyone using Noritake EX-3 on Noblebond? If so for how long?

 

[BB77SCDL]

I was until I kept having fractures and greening!

 

[bleu2th]

I just started using it again. I had tried it when it was first released and then removed from market for reformulation. It is working flawlessly and I am happy with bit castability and fit and compatibility with Noritake Ex-3. I have used NobeCrownSF now for about a year successfully. Difference is a much lighter oxide.

There are absolutely no greening or discoloration issues. You MUST use a wash coat of POB for the first opaque. That is mandatory. Also because of heat distribuition make sure your NOT using a soft tray but rather a ceramic tray and support pegs. I did notice a slight coeficcient crack on a full coverate molar that had not lingual collars. This metal needs metal collars at least on lingual for heat distribution on cooling.

Other than that I am on my third ounce (about 90 units) and no problems with Ex-3. Works well

 

[BB77SCDL]

just a suggestion, don't reuse the buttons. If you do you have to clean them like crazy and even then we were still having problems. We used it with decent results, but when we tried to recycle the old buttons (they say you can) we had issues. If you fired it more than 2-3 times for porcelain it greened and the opaque started to delaminate from the metal. I went by the book on everything and still had problems. We even dried the opaque on a hot plate so it would dry from the inside out.

 

[bleu2th]

I talked with one of the guys that developed Noblebond at Argen and he told me he can take remelting buttons with no new metal to numerous castings. He did comment that paste opaque applications can be an issue if they are thick or dried too quickly trapping air. Admittedly, I use powder opaque and see no issues. Try to opaque with think layers. As far as greening goes if you fire Zirconia in the same oven I would suggest your get Purge ZR from Vision dental. Zirconia builds up contaminants in your muffle. I have seen no greening from this or NobeCrown metal. Might be another issue.

 

[AaronR]

View attachment 3148good evening!! was just looking around the DLN and came across this thread. alot of really good discussion happening here thougth i'd chime in. Re-using the button is OK, but the sprues must first be removed. The complete oxide must be ground off, down to shinny alloy, then blasted with Al-Ox, and washed in the ultrasonic cleaner in Distilled water and then recommended to be used with at least 35% new alloy.
The key here is COMPLETELY removing the Oxide. If the Oxide is left, it will not melt in with the new metal, and will float in the mix and be carried into the new casting. Maybe this was the cause of his greening issues, etc. I have reached out to my metallurgist colleagues at Argen for their further review.

I've included a Noblebond tech sheet to this post as well.

 

[twinrivers14]

With all that you have to go through to make it work wouldn't be cheaper just to use a real semi-precious like argelite 61. Run a button with the sprues on it through Al-oxide steam them off and recast the whole thing. Labor is the biggest cost and if you got to go through all that you mite as well just run a non precious and scrap the button.

 

[erics24k]

CASTING NOBLEBOND w/ Paul Cascone of The Argen Corporation
How To Cast NobleBond by Argen - YouTube

 

[DentalLabHombre]

Thanks to everyone for your feedback. We started back with Noblebond and we had slight hiccups with small fracturing but after some investigating found that we were not following proper protocal. We continue to move forward with Noblebond and I will repost regularly keeping anyone who is interested posted on how all goes. I must also add that Argen's customer service and tech support is second to none. We truly appreciate all there help with this alloy.

 

[AaronR]

ODSA,
great to hear that you have started back with Noblebond!!! and I personally am interested in hearing your regular feedback as well as you know, my colleagues and I are always happy to service our partner-clients at a very high level and thank you for the kind and sincere remarks!!

All the best,
Aaron

 

[DentalLabHombre]

Aaron,
I'll keep in touch and let you know how all goes. Marlin and our local rep Dan came in and gave us some great instruction. I'll keep posting with feedback as we continue forward. Again, thanks to all at Argen for all your support.

Mark,
Oral Designs.

 

[erics24k]

ODSA,
Glad we could be of help. And thank you for the kind remarks. You are working with two of the best in the industry in Dan and Marlin!

Have a great one,
Eric
The Argen Corp.

 

[Paulie]

We started with the NobleBond last week. Single units no problems but the first 2 3u bridges had checklines. Anyone have this kind of problem?

 

[AaronR]

Good morning Paulie! So happy to hear that you are using the Noblebond! and we at Argen want you to have the best success with this alloy and are happy to serve you the best we can. Below you will find a helpful instructional technical sheet on Noblebond. Also, i would like to refer you to our internal technical team at Argen who can be a great resource as well in helping you with the success of this alloy. You can reach our technical support team at 800-255-5524 (Marlin or Le Jon). I also attached our NobleBond white paper by our lead metalurgist Paul Cascone that shares the benefits of this alloy, especially over implants.


View attachment Noblebond Instructions_rev0712.pdf
View attachment Noblebond white paper.pdf

 

[qclab]

Aaron
What type of hot plate do you recommend. We have to replace ours.

Thank You

 

[AaronR]

Most of the hotplates work but the one that we recommend is the Aroma brand hotplate. We like this one because it is flat and good for the units when placing them on the hotplate. These can also be found at Target or Walmart and retail from around $16 - $30.

 

[AaronR]

here is a link to the wal-mart website for the Aroma hotplate:

Find the Aroma Single-Burner Portable Electric Range for an everyday low price at Walmart.com

 

[qclab]

Thank you, Aaron!

 

[AaronR]

also, here is the link to our Youtube video on casting NobleBond:
How To Cast NobleBond by Argen - YouTube

 

[twinrivers14]

I agree with the customer service comment about argen one of the last companies that have field reps that actually come see you and talk to you. Mack Baker is our rep and they just dont make them like that any more. If we have ever had a problem question or anything else he goes above and beyond for you. Weve been using argen metals for awhile now and with the ones we use we have no problems. argelite 61, argenco 40 and their Y+