Digital workflow doing dentures

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jeppe

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you still need to hand finish parts of our job but the quality of fit and design is much higher and more consistent using cadcam.

I understand hand finishing needs to be done, but it seems to be minimal.

Do you mean the fit on the model or in mouth? How do you control this fit? With eye or some other method?

What do you mean by higher design? Do you mean it is estethically higher quality or what?

Consistent results I understand, that seems to be an obvious advantage.

What kind of partials do you do? Metal frames or only acrylic partials?

Have you calculated costs doing digital or analog? Which method provides better income for lab?
 
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grantoz

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i get that you are scared to invest ,both metal and acrylic partials fit better on the model and in the mouth. i worked out the cost digital is better . besides if you dont go digital in some form you will not have a business so therefore staying in analog becomes very expensive.
 
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Hi, I don't agree that this is an issue to be scared about, it's only business after all... 😂

I have just reasoned out that it is not yet the right time for me to go digital for removables, businesswise. However, I'm constantly testing and evaluating the situation.

If you already have digital infrastructure in your lab for other than removables, then it might be reasonable.

That "besides if you don't go, others will..." is typical salesman gibberish that they use to promote something that is otherwise hard to sell to customers.

How do you produce metal frameworks, with what systems? I have tested a few different digital products and have not yet found a better than analog solution. I would be very interested in finding a good solution for those metal frameworks :)
 
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Ok Jeppe its your decision i can only go off my experience in my lab and the fact about 70% at least of my clients send me scans instead of impressions.
 
TheLabGuy

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Ok Jeppe its your decision i can only go off my experience in my lab and the fact about 70% at least of my clients send me scans instead of impressions.
It's okay to disagree...I'm actually happy he disagrees, more digital work for me. 70% is digital??? You go over achiever. I wish all mine was...I'm about 50% now. I did stop accepting new clients that don't have a scanner though. To be a new client with us you have to have a scanner...too dam busy and I despise that fkn model room. Can't wait till the day I pretend it's one of those BLM peaceful protests and watch it burn!!!...lol
 
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i get that you are scared to invest ,both metal and acrylic partials fit better on the model and in the mouth. i worked out the cost digital is better . besides if you dont go digital in some form you will not have a business so therefore staying in analog becomes very expensive.
I disagree that digital is a better quality counting all the sales reps from all companies saying a digital denture is a cheap denture and you can not charge the same price as an analogue denture.
One, it is a mono color. Teeth are printed in a mono color too. Can not be relined with standard acrylic( have to use binder and you know what the results are ) cost wise a good printer is about $10 to 15 k, resin is not cheap ($300 to $400/L. Dentsply is selling their resin to only Carbon users. That is $50 k a year lease. So calculate all your digital equipment VS analogue, your way ahead with analogue knowing what the price is for reg acrylic. Tell me what you think about this: A dentist ask for a denture for an X patient. A lab does a printed denture. Patient does not know that because it is the last thing that a dentist want to give away. Patient X move to a different city or a different dentist and ask to be relined. New dentist does not know it is printed, the new lab gets this denture to reline, at the end he tries to finish it, it starts falling apart because he did not use bonder. On top of that if that printed denture has a bonded fiber, the new lab starts festooning and the fibers goes in the dust. Results: the patient is scared, the lab is screwed and the dentist is screwed. Less than 15% of dentist uses digital denture or at least ask for it according to some statistics.
Peace.
 
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grantoz

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fastfngr to a point i agree with you about digital dentures but what im talking about is if you go thru all the posts ,is that you need to have some digital abilities in your lab like for models cocr frameworks and so on. i just completed a partial that was from a intra oral scanner model the chrome was made using digital tech the teeth i put on were in acrylic done the old fashion way but bottom line the fit was perfect it was faster as i just exported the files to my chrome lab and the dentist was super happy.Do you need to go and buy a 60 grand mill printer solution for making dentures no, but you do need to be able to print models and be able to import and export files to get stuff made.
 
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I disagree that digital is a better quality counting all the sales reps from all companies saying a digital denture is a cheap denture and you can not charge the same price as an analogue denture.
One, it is a mono color. Teeth are printed in a mono color too. Can not be relined with standard acrylic( have to use binder and you know what the results are ) cost wise a good printer is about $10 to 15 k, resin is not cheap ($300 to $400/L. Dentsply is selling their resin to only Carbon users. That is $50 k a year lease. So calculate all your digital equipment VS analogue, your way ahead with analogue knowing what the price is for reg acrylic. Tell me what you think about this: A dentist ask for a denture for an X patient. A lab does a printed denture. Patient does not know that because it is the last thing that a dentist want to give away. Patient X move to a different city or a different dentist and ask to be relined. New dentist does not know it is printed, the new lab gets this denture to reline, at the end he tries to finish it, it starts falling apart because he did not use bonder. On top of that if that printed denture has a bonded fiber, the new lab starts festooning and the fibers goes in the dust. Results: the patient is scared, the lab is screwed and the dentist is screwed. Less than 15% of dentist uses digital denture or at least ask for it according to some statistics.
Peace.
Please let me clarify...I don't think digital dentures are the way to go at all. Printed Dentures blow and Milled dentures are not economical. That's why my video shows a blend of the digital path using the analog/traditional denture setup. The workflow shown was to show you how easy it is to accept scans and print models from the digital scans the Doc sends you. Once you have the printed models, then you can do whatever you want with them...go the traditional route like I did or if you want to go the full digital route, have at it. But to say don't go digital because you think it's an 'all digital or nothing' concept is bogus...mix it up and you'll be on the forefront and prepared for when these manufactures finally do ever come out with printed acrylic or something even better.
 
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Ok Jeppe its your decision i can only go off my experience in my lab and the fact about 70% at least of my clients send me scans instead of impressions.

I would like to know more about doing cocr frames digitally, how do you do them? With what system?
 
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grantoz

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jeepe we cant teach you all this stuff in a couple of posts you need to get training ie invest some time and money we can only point you in the right direction you have to to do the walking.
 
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jeppe

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Exactly. I would greatly appreciate it if you could point me in the right direction by telling me the product that you have good experiences with so I can get some training on that.

I'm not trying to be disrespectful, sorry if I sound like that. I really respect you guys that have made the transition to digital and would be glad if you would share your experiences. After all, isn't that kind of the point in being on forums like this?
 
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TheLabGuy

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I would like to know more about doing cocr frames digitally, how do you do them? With what system?
A few ways...you can accept scan, print model and go traditional route. Or you can accept scan, print model and design partial using exocad partial module. Or you can accept scan and send to 3drpd.com to do it for you. Tons of ways, but being able to accept scans is the first step ..and not really a hard one.
 
rkm rdt

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A few ways...you can accept scan, print model and go traditional route. Or you can accept scan, print model and design partial using exocad partial module. Or you can accept scan and send to 3drpd.com to do it for you. Tons of ways, but being able to accept scans is the first step ..and not really a hard one.
3 appointments
#1 pt scan
#2 tryin no bite block required
#3 finish. Probably could reduce the visits to 2.

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