COVID-19 RESTRICTION AND LOCKDOWNS- HOW YOU COPING??

[HonestAbe]

I'd be livid if I was working in a hospital and was forced to work alongside someone that had an increased risk of unknowingly bringing a highly infectious and dangerous virus into a building full of vulnerable and sick people that have a much higher risk of dying from it. Literally the opposite of "do no harm".

 

[A. M.]

From the perspective of people that accept the science and recommendations as best practice, it's far more likely that she would orphan her children by getting covid and dying from it than suffering an adverse reaction to the vaccine. Who would help your nephew then? It would be tragic and awful either way, but it's not a compelling argument for not getting vaccinated IMHO.

After doing more research, I will say that I misunderstood and misspoke about something. The vaccine lowers the chances of getting the virus, but once you've gotten it, it doesn't lower the chances of spreading it. I was stating that it decreases the chances of spreading it, but incorrect about why. If you don't get infected, then you can't spread it, that's how it lowers the chance of spreading it, not by the vaccine itself.

I've read a few articles about how many people are quitting/fired over the vaccine thing, looks to be less than 1% and that includes all staff, not just nurses and doctors, but everyone that works at those facilities. Needless to say it's a relief that the number isn't higher. You know what's really tragic? All the staff that died of the virus before the vaccine existed when they were just doing their best to manage things in a chaotic and dangerous situation.

So she witnessed more then 1 co-worker having a reaction... but it's very rare... sure
Why do you assume that a non vaccinated person is sick? Or spreading the virus?
The vaccine is not lowering the chances of getting the virus. Only helps with the symptoms. ( "Breakthrough infections")
There are studies showing that a vaccinated or non vaccinated carry the same amount of virus...
And it's more then 1% of staff... otherwise why call in the national guards to help the hospitals, like in New York???

 

[HonestAbe]

So she witnessed more then 1 co-worker having a reaction... but it's very rare... sure
Why do you assume that a non vaccinated person is sick? Or spreading the virus?
The vaccine is not lowering the chances of getting the virus. Only helps with the symptoms. ( "Breakthrough infections")
There are studies showing that a vaccinated or non vaccinated carry the same amount of virus...
And it's more then 1% of staff... otherwise why call in the national guards to help the hospitals, like in New York???

Her opinion that the vaccine caused a reaction is just that. Correlation does not equal causation. There could be any number of reasons they had those issues. It might be the vaccine but it's much more probable that it's not.

The vaccine does reduce the chance of getting the virus and lowers the severity of the symptoms if you do get it. You can choose not to believe the overwhelming majority of experts. You can choose to believe they're not an overwhelming majority. It's your right to listen to whomever you want. I understand given those beliefs why you feel the way you do.

I had heard they might use the guard to supplement things if needed, but hadn't heard anything about them being called in yet. Are they being used now?

 

[doug]

Decision, decisions.

 

[Brett Hansen CDT]

Her opinion that the vaccine caused a reaction is just that. Correlation does not equal causation. There could be any number of reasons they had those issues. It might be the vaccine but it's much more probable that it's not.

The vaccine does reduce the chance of getting the virus and lowers the severity of the symptoms if you do get it. You can choose not to believe the overwhelming majority of experts. You can choose to believe they're not an overwhelming majority. It's your right to listen to whomever you want. I understand given those beliefs why you feel the way you do.

I had heard they might use the guard to supplement things if needed, but hadn't heard anything about them being called in yet. Are they being used now?

National Guard has been deployed in IN to help deal with the overflow of patients due to lack of health care workers to handle all the COVID patients in addition to the normal patients that end up the in the hospital.

Edited to include sources: https://www.indystar.com/story/news...-gets-help-indiana-national-guard/5891099001/

 

[Affinity]

Now that everyone agrees it does not make you immune, why do you still call it a vaccine? It does not fit the definition of a vaccine or meet the threshold of effectiveness to be rated as a vaccine, thus the 'booster'.
Abe name one, of these majority of experts. Name just one! They forfeit their expertise when they cite pfizers effectiveness in a study of a few hundred people over 2 months. You think thats scientific expertise? or pushing through drugs even though advisory panel vote not to. Its easy to come to a easy concensus when you only listen to what you believe, and everything else is unsubstantiated conspiracy theory. Why do you deny injuries come from vaccines? Cmon man!

 

[HonestAbe]

Now that everyone agrees it does not make you immune, why do you still call it a vaccine? It does not fit the definition of a vaccine or meet the threshold of effectiveness to be rated as a vaccine, thus the 'booster'.
Abe name one, of these majority of experts. Name just one! They forfeit their expertise when they cite pfizers effectiveness in a study of a few hundred people over 2 months. You think thats scientific expertise? or pushing through drugs even though advisory panel vote not to. Its easy to come to a easy concensus when you only listen to what you believe, and everything else is unsubstantiated conspiracy theory. Why do you deny injuries come from vaccines? Cmon man!

Never said it's 100% effective. Though it's considered highly effective. I'm using the colloquial definitions. If you want you can look them up too it's not too difficult.

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www.dictionary.com

Check out number 2 especially, it also means resistance

Dictionary.com | Meanings & Definitions of English Words

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Yup fits that definition too, preventative (lowers the chances of getting it) and gives you immunity (resistance) if you do get it.

I can google all the vaccines for you and find out who was on the teams and look up their education and research history and vet them all for you but you won't accept that any of them knows what they're talking about so why should I bother spending my time doing that? I think the longer this goes on, and the more people that get vaccinated that there's a growing apprehension among the people that deny its effectiveness or benefit that they have to confront the possibility that they're wrong at some point.

A lot of people in this thread seem fine with purely anecdotal evidence as the basis for their views, so it should be fine when I use that as evidence right? I know people that died of covid, don't' know a single one that had more than a day or two of feeling sick after the vaccine, and no bad reactions.

 

[A. M.]

Her opinion that the vaccine caused a reaction is just that. Correlation does not equal causation. There could be any number of reasons they had those issues. It might be the vaccine but it's much more probable that it's not.

The vaccine does reduce the chance of getting the virus and lowers the severity of the symptoms if you do get it. You can choose not to believe the overwhelming majority of experts. You can choose to believe they're not an overwhelming majority. It's your right to listen to whomever you want. I understand given those beliefs why you feel the way you do.

I had heard they might use the guard to supplement things if needed, but hadn't heard anything about them being called in yet. Are they being used now?

Her opinion? Witnessing it? Or when the guy called her and said "Do not get this vaccine, I thought I'm gonna die"
So many reasons? Sure... They were ok on the morning, went to get the shot... they got sick. I'm sure it had nothing to do with it... they probably had a bad coffee that morning.
Explain me how is it reducing the chance of getting the virus? You will have a bubble around you after the shot?
You don't understand my beliefs, or the way I feel... and you don't need to. We both have rights and we can think, believe, feel anything we want! I might not agree with what you call normal, but it's ok. You are free to do so.
Those people that are losing their jobs now, have families, they all have their stories, backgrounds, whatever... and they were there for you, for me, for everybody to help without a beep, without question in the past 18 months of this pandemic. Especially at the beginning when we had no data of what we are dealing with.
And if these people are medical professionals, don't you think they might be able to make a better decision then you and me, since they saw first hand of what is happening, and evaluated the risk and benefit? They didn't base their decision on what the media was forcing down our throat?
These people show more compassion by still willing to take care of the sick, without the protection of a vaccine, that doesn't prevent you from getting covid, then the ones who says we shouldn't treat people who didn't take the vaccine...

 

[Affinity]

The FDA has a threshold for effectiveness. Do you know what it is? Its the reason they voted not to approve the booster, because the FDA definition of a vaccine has to have lasting immunity, this one does not. They also changed the definition of it on their website. If the vaccine reduced symptoms, people wouldnt be dying from a breakthrough infection. How many pathology reports has the FDA published about people who have died after the vaccine? How many autopsies? How can you prove people are injured from an injection without a pathology or autopsy? Independent Drs are doing them, why do you ignore them? I could list half a dozen right now, and you cant name a single one. Youre in the cult of the TV Dr in a lab coat. You think he spends his day seeing patients or getting his makeup?
Heres another anecdote, Drs secretary told me today her, her husband and 94yo mother all got covid. If you believe the tv, the mother surely died. No, they had a minor headache and no sense of smell. They all used quercetin, zinc and ivermectin prescribed by the local pharmacist.

You can sit there and seriously say that if you worked in a hospital you wouldnt want people with infectious disease coming in? What do you think medicine is? Stick to something you know more about, like casting.

 

[Flipperlady]

I think the marketplace will decide if the vaccine will be "mandated". Years ago (not that long ago lol) I knew I wanted to be a lab tech but went to work in a dental office to make sure I knew what I was getting into. The dentist I worked for did not wear gloves... I insisted on wearing gloves and the dentist would routinely tell me that if I was scared of a little spit and blood then maybe I was in the wrong profession. This was about the time Aids started... One day a woman came in for a cleaning, I had gloves on the dentist didn't. The woman took me aside and asked how he could go without gloves, and she left. From that day forward the dentist wore gloves I think the same will happen with the vaccine, patients will want to know their providers have been vaccinated, the providers will want to make sure the vendors are vaccinated as well...

 

[LuthorCorp]

The FDA has a threshold for effectiveness. Do you know what it is? Its the reason they voted not to approve the booster, because the FDA definition of a vaccine has to have lasting immunity, this one does not. They also changed the definition of it on their website. If the vaccine reduced symptoms, people wouldnt be dying from a breakthrough infection. How many pathology reports has the FDA published about people who have died after the vaccine? How many autopsies? How can you prove people are injured from an injection without a pathology or autopsy? Independent Drs are doing them, why do you ignore them? I could list half a dozen right now, and you cant name a single one. Youre in the cult of the TV Dr in a lab coat. You think he spends his day seeing patients or getting his makeup?
Heres another anecdote, Drs secretary told me today her, her husband and 94yo mother all got covid. If you believe the tv, the mother surely died. No, they had a minor headache and no sense of smell. They all used quercetin, zinc and ivermectin prescribed by the local pharmacist.

You can sit there and seriously say that if you worked in a hospital you wouldnt want people with infectious disease coming in? What do you think medicine is? Stick to something you know more about, like casting.

Like Abe said providing any names and taking the time to research it is irrelevant because you won't accept them as tell the truth, they are all working to funnel money into pockets and not helping people.

The examples continue to be anecdotal personal stories which have no relevance on the big picture, the disease isn't 100% lethal so yes you are going to get people in the high risk have next to no issues, and people in low risk die.

 

[sidesh0wb0b]

what about natural immunity? funny this keeps getting glossed over.

 

[Brett Hansen CDT]

what about natural immunity? funny this keeps getting glossed over.

It's not glossed over, we just don't have enough good data on it yet. The best info seems to be that the immunity that comes from getting COVID is variable. For some it is robust, for others it wanes more quickly. The protection from the vaccine is much more known and predictable.

 

[LuthorCorp]

what about natural immunity? funny this keeps getting glossed over.

Also its predicated on the fact that you have to get Covid to begin with...

 

[sidesh0wb0b]

It's not glossed over, we just don't have enough good data on it yet. The best info seems to be that the immunity that comes from getting COVID is variable. For some it is robust, for others it wanes more quickly. The protection from the vaccine is much more known and predictable.

can you cite sources for this hypothesis? i mean, natural immunity has been around longer than the "vaccines" so how is it possible theres not enough data on that but plenty for stripping rights and forcing shots?

 

[sidesh0wb0b]

Also its predicated on the fact that you have to get Covid to begin with...

which a whole lot of people have gotten AND recovered from. the vast majority.

 

[LuthorCorp]

which a whole lot of people have gotten AND recovered from. the vast majority.

Sure and a large portion have died from it... with a mortality rate high of 9.2% in Peru, with the worldwide average being around 2.5 - 3% mortality. 4.55 million deaths, which could have been mitigated and reduced by the vaccine. Their "Natural Immunity" didn't do much, and its why they speculate that it doesn't work. Allowing people to get naturally resistant opens the doors for mutations and variants, which then make previous immunity null.

 

[Brett Hansen CDT]

can you cite sources for this hypothesis? i mean, natural immunity has been around longer than the "vaccines" so how is it possible theres not enough data on that but plenty for stripping rights and forcing shots?

Citing sources isn't going to help. I understand your POV. I hope you consider getting vaccinated at some point

 

[Brett Hansen CDT]

We have been down this road so many times in the past. Go read about Joseph Lister. He is credited with being the first surgeon to advocate for ANTISEPTIC surgery. Before that, surgeons did not clean instruments, hands, clothes, etc before surgeries. He of course was laughed at and called a quack in his day. Back then, the sign of a good surgeon was a blood stained apron.

Joseph Lister - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[sidesh0wb0b]

We have been down this road so many times in the past. Go read about Joseph Lister. He is credited with being the first surgeon to advocate for ANTISEPTIC surgery. Before that, surgeons did not clean instruments, hands, clothes, etc before surgeries. He of course was laughed at and called a quack in his day. Back then, the sign of a good surgeon was a blood stained apron.

Joseph Lister - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

read up about Dr Robert Malone, the inventor of mRNA vaccines and DNA vaccines....and the reasons why he is against the covid vaccines.

unless that scientist doesnt count.