Can a lab get in trouble for using non authentic parts?

[bigj1972]

After being in this business almost 30 years I can tell you guys, no customer wants to pay more than they have to. But they are coming to you for your expertise, and you should charge for it. Including what Tom Z called "the cost".
If you want to make deals, go down to the local flea market.
This is a business. And you are supposed to be at the top of your game. If you're not, work on it. So you can have the confidence to charge for your work.
Then, charge for it. What you need to operate that business. Your client relies on you. And if he wants to be a cheap ass, then how reliable is he? If he doesn't want to pay your fee, someone else will. And he can go chasing after the back magazine ads and see how that works. This isn't a compromise, nor a charity, nor a discount barn. Some of you need to step up your skills, others need to step up their backbone. If you're not turning away business right now, you're doing something wrong.

 

[KingGhidorah]

After being in this business almost 30 years I can tell you guys, no customer wants to pay more than they have to. But they are coming to you for your expertise, and you should charge for it. Including what Tom Z called "the cost".
If you want to make deals, go down to the local flea market.
This is a business. And you are supposed to be at the top of your game. If you're not, work on it. So you can have the confidence to charge for your work.
Then, charge for it. What you need to operate that business. Your client relies on you. And if he wants to be a cheap ass, then how reliable is he? If he doesn't want to pay your fee, someone else will. And he can go chasing after the back magazine ads and see how that works. This isn't a compromise, nor a charity, nor a discount barn. Some of you need to step up your skills, others need to step up their backbone. If you're not turning away business right now, you're doing something wrong.

I agree with you, and my lab I work for does do that, and they charge a lot for the work, but for some reason they are cheap about the abutments, which is why I came here to look for ideas to convince them to stop being cheap.

 

[KingGhidorah]

yo no usaría un zimmer en un biohorizons, el hexágono de zimmer es cónico, de 2.45 ~ a 2.39mm (1 grado),por 1,5 mm de longitud y biohorizon es de 2.41mm (totalmente recto) por 1,5mm de longitud. Lo haría ver elevado como si fuera más grande, en longitud, uno con respecto al otro.
Pero si usaría un biohorizon en un Zimmer ya que adaptaría bien por el cono que le menciono.

Good info, I was having trouble finding the actual measurements for how they differed.

 

[bigj1972]

 

[npdynamite]

I agree with you, and my lab I work for does do that, and they charge a lot for the work, but for some reason they are cheap about the abutments, which is why I came here to look for ideas to convince them to stop being cheap.

Sometimes the problem isn't in a fact, reason, or not having an idea. Sometimes you just have to consider that integrity, ethics, and ego of the decision maker is the real problem

 

[MrNeverFixit]

The lab i work for. We used parts/brands thats sent/request by the doctor. If they want genuine we use that. If they want custom we do that.

 

[a3dl]

We use 3rd part for most cases and our drs know this. If they want OEM they request it.
All about communications

 

[illidan]

you should be ok. there are many labs out there who are milling abutments without proper clearance/requirements. at least you are not manufacturing abutments.

 

[npdynamite]

you should be ok. there are many labs out there who are milling abutments without proper clearance/requirements. at least you are not manufacturing abutments.

This is not good reasoning. "I can do it becuase other people are doing something worse" is always a path to a bad place

 

[illidan]

This is not good reasoning. "I can do it becuase other people are doing something worse" is always a path to a bad place

when cmc got shutdown, did gov go after cmc customers?
it is a liability of whoever manufactures.

 

[Brett Hansen CDT]

when cmc got shutdown, did gov go after cmc customers?
it is a liability of whoever manufactures.

I was never thinking about this in terms of the government coming after you. What happens when the implant fails, or the part you supplied fails, and the doctor that sends you lots of implant cases loses trust in you as a dental technician? These failures happen and it can have nothing to do with the restoration you created. It's all about how you recover from the failure. If it's an OEM part or an Atlantis abutment, warranty on the implant and abutment is covered. My main concern with not informing the doctor about what parts you use in their cases is that if you lose their trust you will most likely lose their business.

 

[illidan]

I was never thinking about this in terms of the government coming after you. What happens when the implant fails, or the part you supplied fails, and the doctor that sends you lots of implant cases loses trust in you as a dental technician? These failures happen and it can have nothing to do with the restoration you created. It's all about how you recover from the failure. If it's an OEM part or an Atlantis abutment, warranty on the implant and abutment is covered. My main concern with not informing the doctor about what parts you use in their cases is that if you lose their trust you will most likely lose their business.

we ask new dr whether dr wants generic or authentic. then we put in under dr preference. i rarely had generic custom ti abut fail.

 

[npdynamite]

Some 3rd party parts will have a similar warrenty to the OEM part to help give labs and Dr's the confidence to use them. I think in reality you are almost never going to see an implant fail do to a 3rd party abutment. Also I think we are only talking about FDA cleared parts though Illidan has a point with some labs manufacturing without proper FDA complience/approval, but I feel like thats a slightly seperate issue. So in general the parts should be good to go and should not lead to failure. So to add to what Brett said, I think the biggest thing that can happen, which this whole thread highlites is if you aren't being honest about what you are using, when people inevitably find out whether through failure or observation they will lose trust in you and you will lose clients

 

[npdynamite]

when cmc got shutdown, did gov go after cmc customers?
it is a liability of whoever manufactures.

Did cmc get shut down? I know they changed hands at least once, possibly multiple times. The only reason I ask is becuase I just spoke to someone on the phone at CMC 10 minutes ago

 

[illidan]

Did cmc get shut down? I know they changed hands at least once, possibly multiple times. The only reason I ask is becuase I just spoke to someone on the phone at CMC 10 minutes ago

last i know they got shutdown couple years ago and now only milling crowns. they might have rebuilt implant department by now though. didn't like their abutments anyway, couldn't mill split file correctly.

 

[doug]

We don't need more hearsay on this bored. Misinformation is a cancer.

 

[npdynamite]

We don't need more hearsay on this bored. Misinformation is a cancer.

But it's so much fun...

 

[Car 54]

Did cmc get shut down? I know they changed hands at least once, possibly multiple times. The only reason I ask is becuase I just spoke to someone on the phone at CMC 10 minutes ago

Was it for hardware support? As I thought I had heard the same thing as illidan, that they had shut down, at least their milling center?

 

[npdynamite]

Was it for hardware support? As I thought I had heard the same thing as illidan, that they had shut down, at least their milling center?I

I can confidently say they are a milling center. I don't want to comment too much on what all transpired because it was relayed to me by a former employee and despite my comment, I prefer to stay away from misinformation and I don't feel I could relay what happened without getting something wrong. That said I know they changed hands and are no longer in Colorado, they are in New York and refer to themselves on their website as "CMC Aurora Digital Technology Center" A month or two ago I called because we purchased a scan body from them. After recieving the scan body they told us that the library wasn't FDA approved to be distributed, we had to scan the case and send it to them to design and manufacture in order for it to be FDA complient. I was annoyed by the fact that we weren't informed of that prior to ordering the scan body. I don't know exactly what happened as I left that lab before the case was completed. The lab I am now at just happened to already be using them for zirconia, which is why I talked to them today.

 

[Car 54]

I can confidently say they are a milling center. I don't want to comment too much on what all transpired because it was relayed to me by a former employee and despite my comment, I prefer to stay away from misinformation and I don't feel I could relay what happened without getting something wrong. That said I know they changed hands and are no longer in Colorado, they are in New York and refer to themselves on their website as "CMC Aurora Digital Technology Center" A month or two ago I called because we purchased a scan body from them. After recieving the scan body they told us that the library wasn't FDA approved to be distributed, we had to scan the case and send it to them to design and manufacture in order for it to be FDA complient. I was annoyed by the fact that we weren't informed of that prior to ordering the scan body. I don't know exactly what happened as I left that lab before the case was completed. The lab I am now at just happened to already be using them for zirconia, which is why I talked to them today.

Very helpful, thank you