Trios vs. Itero IOS

[KentPWalton]

I intend to find out why the sudden interest in the Trios by my docs, but I don't think they understand the costs involved to be able to export STL files using this system...and this is supposed to be an "open" system.

Haha...it's as open as your wallet is!!

 

[2thm8kr]

In iTero, you can scan any scan body and designate it as other on the case manager software. So in essence, it doesn't matter

what scan body geometry you're scanning as long as you have that particular library in your 3D design software.

I'll add that the IO scanners don't care what scan bodies you use as long as they are not too tall. The rotation and placement is determined by the CAD implant library in your particular software.

 

[KentPWalton]

I'll add that the IO scanners don't care what scan bodies you use as long as they are not too tall. The rotation and placement is determined by the CAD implant library in your particular software.

Agreed 100%!!

 

[rkm rdt]

 

[PDC]

In iTero, you can scan any scan body and designate it as other on the case manager software. So in essence, it doesn't matter

what scan body geometry you're scanning as long as you have that particular library in your 3D design software.

That said, a company that supplies a library and scan bodies is highly unlikely to add another

system's scan body into their library.

Help me to understand this. Let's do an example: If the doctor scans say an Atlantis scan body, then he has the option in "his" software to choose "other" for the implant company. When I receive the case in Lab Review, do I then pick up the STL's and bring it into my DW software. At this point, if I wanted to choose the Argen implant library, then it would position the abutments and platform size in the proper place?

Never been this route before...I guess I would have to do the model builder option to get a model since I couldn't get it through Itero using this method.

I can see I am "time and technology deficient"...Thanks for your help!

 

[2thm8kr]

Implant libraries of company 'x' are all the same except for the connection geometry and in the software are all oriented the same(rotation timing). In your CAD software you are going to specify which system you are using. Only then will the software determine the positioning and rotation of the connection according to the scan body.

If you use Atlantis scan body and try to change to Argen's NT library it will not work because the libraries scan bodies are different shape, size, and orientation.

 

[Sevan P]

It would seem like one should be able to cut off the receiving end of an Itero model and scan it and add it to the library. Of course nothing is ever that simple.

It is not all that simple. It has to be an stl file, so you have to draw it up in solidworks or any cad software then import it into 3shape. It is very easy to do, maybe I can draw one up today and try it out.

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk

 

[Beatrice]

As IO scanner,
Trios is a faster unit then iTero and will even get faster once the software update is coming (code name : insane mode)
The only benefit of iTero as today is the invisalign. But that end in Q4 because 3Shape will be compatible with Invisalign.

Now concerning scan body, yeah it suck, yeah it really not well done by companies. This is a total non-sense and it stupid the way it was done first.

So here the deal, you scan an object with your scanner, whatever the shape as long the scanner see it.
In the "design" software (3shape, exocad, dental wings) you upload this STL file.
Out of a database you have to "merge" the "technical design" of this scanbody with the provided STL file.
This will give us the orientation of the HEX and the position in "Z" axis of the implant.

The problem is scanbody company do not give for free their "technical design".

Once you have design your part you will send it to a milling center, your design software (exocad, 3shape or dental wings) send the information but it not complete, the "Z" position is hidden. As a milling center we have to either PAY the scanbody company for the library to tell us this data OR we can do reverse engineering.
Reverse engineering mean we have to buy each of the scanbody our customer use, take measurement, create our "technical drawing", incorporate it in a "config file" and ask your (the customer) to install it on your design software.
Once done when you do the "merging" step you have to select us as milling center, now we will be able to know where the "Z" axis is.

If you are good with computer you can do this part before sending to milling center so when you will send the STL file, the bottom part will have been replace by a "technical design" that can be milled.

For an example us at Panthera so far we have reverse engineering ELOS and some DESS scanbody and working to complete DESS.
Next will be NT Trading and after probably Atlantis scanbody and will see after.


From my point of view of milling center : this whole thing is really a piece of garbage!!
But well that how it is.

 

[labtek]

As IO scanner,
Trios is a faster unit then iTero and will even get faster once the software update is coming (code name : insane mode)
The only benefit of iTero as today is the invisalign. But that end in Q4 because 3Shape will be compatible with Invisalign.

Now concerning scan body, yeah it suck, yeah it really not well done by companies. This is a total non-sense and it stupiSd the way it was done first.

So here the deal, you scan an object with your scanner, whatever the shape as long the scanner see it.
In the "design" software (3shape, exocad, dental wings) you upload this STL file.
Out of a database you have to "merge" the "technical design" of this scanbody with the provided STL file.
This will give us the orientation of the HEX and the position in "Z" axis of the implant.

The problem is scanbody company do not give for free their "technical design".

Once you have design your part you will send it to a milling center, your design software (exocad, 3shape or dental wings) send the information but it not complete, the "Z" position is hidden. As a milling center we have to either PAY the scanbody company for the library to tell us this data OR we can do reverse engineering.
Reverse engineering mean we have to buy each of the scanbody our customer use, take measurement, create our "technical drawing", incorporate it in a "config file" and ask your (the customer) to install it on your design software.
Once done when you do the "merging" step you have to select us as milling center, now we will be able to know where the "Z" axis is.

If you are good with computer you can do this part before sending to milling center so when you will send the STL file, the bottom part will have been replace by a "technical design" that can be milled.

For an example us at Panthera so far we have reverse engineering ELOS and some DESS scanbody and working to complete DESS.
Next will be NT Trading and after probably Atlantis scanbody and will see after.


From my point of view of milling center : this whole thing is really a piece of garbage!!
But well that how it is.

 

[labtek]

As IO scanner,
Trios is a faster unit then iTero and will even get faster once the software update is coming (code name : insane mode)
The only benefit of iTero as today is the invisalign. But that end in Q4 because 3Shape will be compatible with Invisalign.

Now concerning scan body, yeah it suck, yeah it really not well done by companies. This is a total non-sense and it stupid the way it was done first.

So here the deal, you scan an object with your scanner, whatever the shape as long the scanner see it.
In the "design" software (3shape, exocad, dental wings) you upload this STL file.
Out of a database you have to "merge" the "technical design" of this scanbody with the provided STL file.
This will give us the orientation of the HEX and the position in "Z" axis of the implant.

The problem is scanbody company do not give for free their "technical design".

Once you have design your part you will send it to a milling center, your design software (exocad, 3shape or dental wings) send the information but it not complete, the "Z" position is hidden. As a milling center we have to either PAY the scanbody company for the library to tell us this data OR we can do reverse engineering.
Reverse engineering mean we have to buy each of the scanbody our customer use, take measurement, create our "technical drawing", incorporate it in a "config file" and ask your (the customer) to install it on your design software.
Once done when you do the "merging" step you have to select us as milling center, now we will be able to know where the "Z" axis is.

If you are good with computer you can do this part before sending to milling center so when you will send the STL file, the bottom part will have been replace by a "technical design" that can be milled.

For an example us at Panthera so far we have reverse engineering ELOS and some DESS scanbody and working to complete DESS.
Next will be NT Trading and after probably Atlantis scanbody and will see after.


From my point of view of milling center : this whole thing is really a piece of garbage!!
But well that how it is.

so when you say the whole thing is a piece of garbage, are you referring to the problem of every system has its own scan body or what?

 

[zero_zero]

Actually is quite simple...once you have the library you have all the info needed, Z height and rotation as well. Here's an example, parts from a lib shifted on the X axis for better visibility. Showing the analog, interface, hybrid base and scan body, each can be easily replaced with another manufacturers part as long as the Z and rotation index matches...so one set of scan body can be used pretty much for all mfgr's out there, given that we have the particular library and time to put a custom library together.

 

[rkm rdt]

 

[KentPWalton]

Help me to understand this. Let's do an example: If the doctor scans say an Atlantis scan body, then he has the option in "his" software to choose "other" for the implant company. When I receive the case in Lab Review, do I then pick up the STL's and bring it into my DW software. At this point, if I wanted to choose the Argen implant library, then it would position the abutments and platform size in the proper place?

Never been this route before...I guess I would have to do the model builder option to get a model since I couldn't get it through Itero using this method.

I can see I am "time and technology deficient"...Thanks for your help!

If the Dr. scans in an Atlantis scan body, then you must use their milling center. If the Dr. chooses to scan a scan body that isn't in the iTero work flow, then he can go ahead and scan it and then upon lab review, you change it to "other" on scan bodies. That's all I was meaning. You can't change the scan body in the scan. He could scan any scan body you want him to work with and you can still output the STL files to import into DW if you'd like. Just make sure he uses the scan bodies you use and you're kosher.

 

[Sevan P]

I was supposed to get a call from Argen today about getting printed Itero models but they never called back. Do you have an interface in your articulators library that will fit the Itero articulators? I know I only have 3 or 4 interface options.

Just saw this in my control panel, I has trying make my own but hell. it is already in there! Bonus!!!


Here is the DME of both vertex and itero. No more having to use the simple articulator and then in the final step add the vertex attachment.

Dropbox link

https://www.dropbox.com/s/t8dqbpycj3sbg67/itero vertex.dme?dl=0

 

[PDC]

Just saw this in my control panel, I has trying make my own but hell. it is already in there! Bonus!!!
View attachment 21737 View attachment 21738

Here is the DME of both vertex and itero. No more having to use the simple articulator and then in the final step add the vertex attachment.

Dropbox link

https://www.dropbox.com/s/t8dqbpycj3sbg67/itero vertex.dme?dl=0

That's great...but I don't have 3shape.

 

[Sevan P]

That's great...but I don't have 3shape.

That's right I forgot your on DW. Can you import stl files and setup you own articulator setup?


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[James Babbi]

Yes. I'm pretty sure that the "Element" is the only upgrade Itero has come out with (other than software) since they began. My account is still having issues with high occlusion, tight contacts, and even tight fits. I don't understand what's going on because the crowns drop on the dies and I can see daylight between the crown and the opposing tooth. They had the same issue with crowns they sent to GW although that could've been a number of things.

I'm pretty frustrated with Itero right now. I have another account who has the previous Itero model and he doesn't have any of those issues.

You can get milled models for other implant systems, but you will need to go through Atlantis which means big bucks. The workflows are the same as Biomet.

iTero's Element is their 3rd generation scanner, so this would be their second upgrade since they started. They have been back ordered for a while, and were shipping to orthodontists first. An easy way to find out is to ask the user if they have an iTero on a rolling cart, or a monitor only type of scanner (Elements).

 

[PDC]

So I think I've got the info I need to do my first printed model using the Model Builder in DWings. I plan on sending the file to Argen. I don't have but a few articulator interfaces available and the one I'm going to use if for the Vertex. My question is: How do you relate the models together since the vertex uses the ball to glue into the interface. Do you add some sort of guide for positioning? With the Itero interface, the bite relationship is maintained when placed on the articulator. Need a little help with this. Thanks.

 

[rkm rdt]

Have them print a wax bite......just kidding.
You should have a bite scan which will articulate the max and my scanc. MB will maintain the bite or your interfaces.

 

[PDC]

Have them print a wax bite......just kidding.
You should have a bite scan which will articulate the max and my scanc. MB will maintain the bite or your interfaces.

So I guess your saying that the printed models will have a positioning guide on them so that they can be glued together in the proper position? I don't use vertex anymore, but I do remember having to hold the models in place while gluing them.