The BDT Technique bridge

Drizzt

Drizzt

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Sorry to hear that Drizz... I hope its nothing serious. It just might be youre getting old:D

Take care of yourself..keep safe and i wish you a speedy recovery.

Just remember Tsipouro,Tsikoudia
and Syrtaki is a dangerous combinationBeer

Thanks man. My basketball career is over, got injured during a basketball game and I destroyed my right knee, got surgery and now I am trying to recover from it. this is a sad day for world basketball, retired at the age of 33:D:D:D:D:D
 
Sda36

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Thanks man. My basketball career is over, got injured during a basketball game and I destroyed my right knee, got surgery and now I am trying to recover from it. this is a sad day for world basketball, retired at the age of 33:D:D:D:D:D
Wow that's rough, wish you the best in a speedy recovery!!

Sent from my LG-H873 using Tapatalk
 
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ilsbadly

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I think the BDT bridges look great, however can someone please explain to me what the point of it is?

This technique just seems a little over engineered, what benefit do you get over using a high end denture tooth? the teeth can be easily replaced if broken, and they can be stained to look 'more realistic' they are much cheaper to produce and they are arguably better for the opposing dentition, and having porc-porc on a F/F isn't advisable.

Also the HPP subframe, if this does break what are the repair processes and costs for this? again what benefit does this material offer? its a better colour? metal is opaqued so isn't an issue. It's lighter? how many patients have you had that have had a full arch with metal substructure fitted thats said 'That feels heavy' I think I would feel much more comfortable with a metal framework than a plastic one if it was for my personal use.
 
Jason D

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I think the BDT bridges look great, however can someone please explain to me what the point of it is?

This technique just seems a little over engineered, what benefit do you get over using a high end denture tooth? the teeth can be easily replaced if broken, and they can be stained to look 'more realistic' they are much cheaper to produce and they are arguably better for the opposing dentition, and having porc-porc on a F/F isn't advisable.

Also the HPP subframe, if this does break what are the repair processes and costs for this? again what benefit does this material offer? its a better colour? metal is opaqued so isn't an issue. It's lighter? how many patients have you had that have had a full arch with metal substructure fitted thats said 'That feels heavy' I think I would feel much more comfortable with a metal framework than a plastic one if it was for my personal use.
Yes, this is just an exercise in artistry and “cuz I could do it”
It’s not practical from a financial or material science standpoint, more like an art project.
I think it’s cool and a neat teaching tool but not applicable in the real world
 
Drizzt

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Yes, this is just an exercise in artistry and “cuz I could do it”
It’s not practical from a financial or material science standpoint, more like an art project.
I think it’s cool and a neat teaching tool but not applicable in the real world

You couldn't be more wrong about your statement. It is by far the easiest way to produce a full arch. I can have it finished from scratch in one day. Plus the Polymer material is ideal for implant cases, and protects the bone, the implants and the masticatory system. It is fully repairable. Plus it looks awesome.

I actually had a patient that already had a metal ceramics bridge on 7 implants, say as soon as we inserted the BDT that ''This one feels so much lighter.'' Also regarding the repair in a potential failure, if the frame breaks there are ways of repairing it but I would redo it. Same thing I would do if a zirconia frame broke. Redo. Also another benefit is the ability to etch polymer. I only had failures with metal+acrylic combo because there is no bond between acrylic and metal. I stopped offering them, because patietns would never wear their mouthguards. They lost their teeth in the first place because of lack of discipline of their oral hygiene (most of them at least),they seem not to care much about their expensive implants either.

BDT is not a mantra for sure, but I would do it instead of a metal ceramics or zirconia ceramics bridge any day.
 
TheLabGuy

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I think the BDT bridges look great, however can someone please explain to me what the point of it is?

This technique just seems a little over engineered, what benefit do you get over using a high end denture tooth? the teeth can be easily replaced if broken, and they can be stained to look 'more realistic' they are much cheaper to produce and they are arguably better for the opposing dentition, and having porc-porc on a F/F isn't advisable.

Also the HPP subframe, if this does break what are the repair processes and costs for this? again what benefit does this material offer? its a better colour? metal is opaqued so isn't an issue. It's lighter? how many patients have you had that have had a full arch with metal substructure fitted thats said 'That feels heavy' I think I would feel much more comfortable with a metal framework than a plastic one if it was for my personal use.
I'll answer this...Three major advantages using the BDT technique over zirconium or metal. 1. Being the use of Pekkton, it's a pressable or millable (I prefer to mill my frames). I know some labs that are using the Pekkton material now for ALL of their fixed custom abutments. Why you ask?...because Pekkton acts like a periodontal ligament, a shock absorber per say where implants traditionally don't have one. 2. Being able to adapt ceramic crowns to the Pekkton framework, patients absolutely LOVE IT!!! So here you have a very light hybrid implant supported denture, that feel's like 'real teeth' (almost every patient states this, it feels so real, like real teeth). 3. The BDT technique, the way if anything fails, that's fine...it can be easily fixed, less than a day in almost all cases. We have done quite a few of these and look forward to doing more and entertaining the idea of doing our own in-house custom abutments using this material.
 
Drizzt

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I'll answer this...Three major advantages using the BDT technique over zirconium or metal. 1. Being the use of Pekkton, it's a pressable or millable (I prefer to mill my frames). I know some labs that are using the Pekkton material now for ALL of their fixed custom abutments. Why you ask?...because Pekkton acts like a periodontal ligament, a shock absorber per say where implants traditionally don't have one. 2. Being able to adapt ceramic crowns to the Pekkton framework, patients absolutely LOVE IT!!! So here you have a very light hybrid implant supported denture, that feel's like 'real teeth' (almost every patient states this, it feels so real, like real teeth). 3. The BDT technique, the way if anything fails, that's fine...it can be easily fixed, less than a day in almost all cases. We have done quite a few of these and look forward to doing more and entertaining the idea of doing our own in-house custom abutments using this material.

I did two single screw retained BDT crowns for my dad who has 45 years on the bench. They feel and behave like real teeth is what he says to me. I am 100% sold after 6 years working with polymers that they are the ideal material for implant retained cases.
 
TheLabGuy

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I did two single screw retained BDT crowns for my dad who has 45 years on the bench. They feel and behave like real teeth is what he says to me. I am 100% sold after 6 years working with polymers that they are the ideal material for implant retained cases.
Gotta love hooking up the old man. I remember I made a denture for my old man, he tried that thing in and spit it back out and threw it at me...'Son, stick with the crowns, you suck at making dentures'...lol
 
kcdt

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You couldn't be more wrong about your statement. It is by far the easiest way to produce a full arch. I can have it finished from scratch in one day. Plus the Polymer material is ideal for implant cases, and protects the bone, the implants and the masticatory system. It is fully repairable. Plus it looks awesome.

I actually had a patient that already had a metal ceramics bridge on 7 implants, say as soon as we inserted the BDT that ''This one feels so much lighter.'' Also regarding the repair in a potential failure, if the frame breaks there are ways of repairing it but I would redo it. Same thing I would do if a zirconia frame broke. Redo. Also another benefit is the ability to etch polymer. I only had failures with metal+acrylic combo because there is no bond between acrylic and metal. I stopped offering them, because patietns would never wear their mouthguards. They lost their teeth in the first place because of lack of discipline of their oral hygiene (most of them at least),they seem not to care much about their expensive implants either.

BDT is not a mantra for sure, but I would do it instead of a metal ceramics or zirconia ceramics bridge any day.
I don't mean to be an ass, but your first paragraph makes a number of claims about stress transfer and bone health that have no support in research literature.

I'm a little too old at this to let sales talk convince me
 
Drizzt

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I don't mean to be an ass, but your first paragraph makes a number of claims about stress transfer and bone health that have no support in research literature.

I'm a little too old at this to let sales talk convince me

There is literature. I will find it and send it to you.

Sales talk ?? I am not selling the material so it is not sales talk, at least from my side.
 
Drizzt

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Gotta love hooking up the old man. I remember I made a denture for my old man, he tried that thing in and spit it back out and threw it at me...'Son, stick with the crowns, you suck at making dentures'...lol

Your old man sounds like he wasn't sweet talking you, said what he believed although I am sure your denture was just fne !! lol
 
TheLabGuy

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Your old man sounds like he wasn't sweet talking you, said what he believed although I am sure your denture was just fne !! lol
This was about 15 years ago...and no, the denture was complete shlt!!! I already forgot more than knew back then. :)
 
kcdt

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There is literature. I will find it and send it to you.

Sales talk ?? I am not selling the material so it is not sales talk, at least from my side.
All I've heard so far is claims about how great the frame is for bone. Never seen a single peer reviewed study.

Unsubstantiated claims are sales talk as far as I'm concerned. I didn't say you were selling anything, just to be clear.
 
kcdt

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Please do, the results of thought experiments are not the same as facts.
Exactly.
I learned not to drink the koolaide long ago.
Remember Artglass?
Mark Jackson said he ate somewhere around 10k remakes.
After that, he became a BIG proponent of FDA and good manufacturing processes.
Otherwise, no legal recourse.

So yeah, show me the beef. I don't deny these are gorgeous.
I want to hear evidence of all these claims about flexure, bone loss, etc.
I want to hear about the potential for delamination of all those flexing layers of disparate materials.
I been asking for a couple of years now, and so far it's bubkis.
 
Jason D

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Exactly.
I learned not to drink the koolaide long ago.
Remember Artglass?
Mark Jackson said he ate somewhere around 10k remakes.
After that, he became a BIG proponent of FDA and good manufacturing processes.
Otherwise, no legal recourse.

So yeah, show me the beef. I don't deny these are gorgeous.
I want to hear evidence of all these claims about flexure, bone loss, etc.
I want to hear about the potential for delamination of all those flexing layers of disparate materials.
I been asking for a couple of years now, and so far it's bubkis.

agreed...I'd love to see real research...3 years ago we were told all the same stories about peek, and now we hear about solubility issues and breakdown of the material intraorally.

Historically we tend to bet very badly on the new materials being "what they are sold as". The result is the 'house' wins in our little gambling adventures, but we, and the patients, suffer.

inceram, spinell and various alumina and silica variants, renaissance crowns, artglass, belleglass, sculpture, targis, emax 2, lava ultimate, all the hybrid nano ceramics, all the polymers (except for this one...maybe) and so many more that I have erased from the memory banks except to be very wary.

the other side of the column for the same time period - leucite reinforced, lithium disilicate, zirconia and.....well that's about all I can think of :p

irrespective of all that, how much do you charge for one of these? Without knowing specifics of the manufacturing process it looks like about 2 grand of crown and bridge on top of a thousand dollar substrate and a five hundred bucks of parts? So $4000? or perhaps a better question is are you charging more or less than an all on 4 type solution? And can it be coded as a permanent restoration with a polymer substrate or does that limit it to a 'temporary' prosthesis?
 
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