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    Milling wax veneers

    Discussion in 'All Porcelain-Press' started by adamb4321, Apr 14, 2018.

    1. adamb4321

      adamb4321 Active Member Full Member

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      I know there is a similar thread running on this. I’ve got 3-3 case of wrap around veneers. I’ve milled three times but the results are poor. I’ve got the edge set to 0.2mm to give some thickness but I’m getting a lot of chipping. The nature of the preps makes some undercut areas, so fitting the patterns to the dies isn’t really working either.

      I’m thinking maybe get them printed instead? Any thoughts on this? Other than that I’m hand waxing them, which will be a pain too.
       
      Last edited: Apr 14, 2018
    2. Jason D

      Jason D Well-Known Member Full Member

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      Mill them thick and reduce by hand. Not a great option but not a lot of choice given that limited space in those conditions
       
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    3. millennium

      millennium Active Member Full Member

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      Oh my GOD, not the hand wax!Eviltongue
       
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    4. cadfan
      Amused

      cadfan Well-Known Member Full Member

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      wax chipping ?? adjust your strats maybe they are **** or your wax
       
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    5. Car 54
      No Mood

      Car 54 Well-Known Member Donator Full Member

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      Base out any undercuts you can. Even though I have a 4 axis mill and it's not going to mill undercuts, I base them out in wax pre scan anyway.
      This week I had a case for 6 veneers. I milled these at 7/10ths using TD Dental grey wax and pressed them with excellent results. I pretty much left them at 7/10ths in wax and after pressing, as I was blocking out ND4 prep shade for a A1 case.

      veneers.PNG
       
      Last edited: Apr 14, 2018
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    6. TheLabGuy

      TheLabGuy Just a Member Full Member

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      I guess I'm old school, but I prefer hand waxing my veneers, especially wrap around margins (usually done to move teeth mesially or distally). Being the ceramist as well, I feel more intimate with the case...ponder that one on a Sunday for ya :)
       
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    7. user name
      Question

      user name Well-Known Member Donator Full Member

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      Don't store your wax in the fridge or on a shelf attached to an external wall. Clean your burs. Make sure you select 'Wax' for your parameters so speeds are slower. Even if you have some undercuts, on a 4 axis mill you can position the undercuts along the Y axis. The puck holder can tilt a few degrees either way on the Y and get a good mill.
       
    8. adamb4321

      adamb4321 Active Member Full Member

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      Yes, the dreaded hand wax. Back in the day I hand waxed what felt like a million Dicor veneers.

      On the face of it this case should have been straight forward, provisionals to copy, preps that at first glance look good. The reality is not quite enough reduction between the teeth, undercut areas and darkish preps.

      I wish I'd just built them up on refractory now.
       
    9. adamb4321

      adamb4321 Active Member Full Member

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      Car54, I'm just looking at your puck. I've been nesting my veneers in a more vertical plane, normally works ok. I'll try the horizontal attitude like yours. I think I'm going to redefine the margins to loose some of the undercut. Which pellet did you use to block out ND4 for A1?
       
    10. ztech

      ztech Active Member Full Member

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      I also use a higher wax content for Veneers. They seem to come out better. I routinely mill at .4. I usually layer the labial surface on max anteriors.
       
    11. Car 54
      No Mood

      Car 54 Well-Known Member Donator Full Member

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      It was Noritake CZR Press LT (Low Translucent) NW0.5. I went light to help keep from a A1 press in getting to dark, or lower value. I'm pretty sure you could use an emax LT BL4 at 7/10ts and be just fine. I use prep colored die spacer so it helps to keep track of how much I can thin it out in the pressed state to be able to layer more porcelain.
       
    12. adamb4321

      adamb4321 Active Member Full Member

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      I remilled the veneers this morning. Nested them in a horizontal attitude rather than vertical and used a different wax. Pleased to say a very good result.

      Car54 i pressed with LTBL3, should look ok with some layering.
       
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    13. Al.
      Yeehaw

      Al. Well-Known Member Full Member

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      Ohhhhhhhh print them !!!!!!
      They come out beautiful and thin !!!!!

      Hand waxing no way
      No more.
      Printed resin is so nice I can contour with acrylic bur and do precision cut backs if layering with a disk then press.

      So freaking fast and easy
       
    14. CoolHandLuke
      Fiendish

      CoolHandLuke 40% titanium Staff Member Full Member

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      good info, i only want to say its not always a good idea to go slower. there is a relationship between how fast your spindle spins, and how quickly it moves point-to-point. this relationship is referred to by many CAM softwares as Cutting speed (as opposed to Spindle speed, or Table feed which are the factors of Cutting speed)

      varying a single parameter of Cutting speed can be good, but also can be bad. in soft materials like zirconia and wax and plastic it is highly advantageous to use high cutting speed, especially if the machine can be kept vibration-free. in hard materials these kinds of high speed passes sometimes arent feasable.

      for wax though, much as with plastic you want to push through the material quickly so that the spindle doesnt sit on any area long enough to create residual heat and melt the wax. too slow and you can have material "gum up" the tools.

      for thin things though, no matter really what it is, veneers in wax, or thin zirconia, or thin titanium copings, avoiding chipping is the biggest objective, and the best guarantee of that is sharp clean NEW tools.
       
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    15. Al.
      Yeehaw

      Al. Well-Known Member Full Member

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      Crap I don’t even saw the dies out any more.
      I scan as unsectioned model.
       
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    16. CoolHandLuke
      Fiendish

      CoolHandLuke 40% titanium Staff Member Full Member

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      so proud of you Al, you have done some really amazing stuff and in the digital world i feel you've made quick work of playing "catch-up" with the technology.
       
    17. Al.
      Yeehaw

      Al. Well-Known Member Full Member

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      CHL it’s changed everything for me for the better

      Can do much better work now all around.
      The “Hand made” crowd will soon he dust in the wind IMO.

      Not a cave man anymore
      Still really suck at a lot of designs though
       
    18. JMN
      Curious

      JMN Christian Member Staff Member Donator Full Member

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      Well, I might as well not play if *you* are doing much better work and more of it.
       
    19. 2thm8kr
      Devilish

      2thm8kr Beanosavedmysociallife Full Member

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      A digital convert.:android:
       
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