CEREC and USB 2.0

[patmo141]

So, guess what I found out today...the blue cam which connects to the "CEREC AC" (doctor handheld version) is usb 2.0...kind of. I looked in the device manager of the unit and tracked down the drivers from a company called "Matrix Vision." They make lots of imaging equipment but the "BlueFox" series (which is what the driver on the CEREC computer uses) are all USB 2.0 cameras.

hardware - industrial cameras, frame grabbers, USB cameras, smart cameras | industrial image processing - MATRIX VISION

Furthermore, I found the technical data sheet for the unit itself, which even says it's usb 2.0

http://www.dentalunion.nl/nieuw/Downloads/handleidingen/CEREC AC Technical data.pdf

So, I couldn't really dig deep inside the casing to find the camera connection to the CPU, but I assume they have it soldered directly to an internal USB port. But that is kind of neat. Possible to make your own handhled 3d scanner...?

(hint hint Italian hackers)

 

[Mark Jackson]

There is no reason you can't use a hand held scanner for lab applications. In fact, I have a customer who does it all the time. It won't be long and our little toaster oven scanners will look more like an electric toothbrush.

 

[rkm rdt]

Retirement Plan 2.0

Bootleg dentures...woo hoo!

 

[DMC]

neat discovery!

 

[patmo141]

There is no reason you can't use a hand held scanner for lab applications.

Yeaaaah..but I want one I can plug into my laptop and carry around in my backpack! And not cost 30k. I know i know, not how the world works. But, my theory is that if you get a hold of just a blue cam camera, download the appropriate drivers, you could use the sirona equipment for a compact portable scanning system. Not for clinical use probably, but for educational it would be awesome. How much would a replacement blue cam cost? Or a broken/refurbished one?

 

[jamie newlands]

hi Patmo,

Having just finished stripping down and rebuilding one of my ac's I thought id update.

The bluecam connects to a custom video capture card made for sirona by Matrox Vision (same people that make graphics cards). The card itself is a full size PCI card. As such there is no direct way to connect it to a laptop. USB 2.0 does not carry sufficicient data bandwidth to work with it and there are currently no usb 2.0 to pci adaptors.

It is however theoretically possible to make a laptop cerec AC. I'm working on it at the moment. Once it's working Im happy to tell you how. The challenge will be finding a capture card as they are only available as a swap out from sirona.

hope this helps

jamie

 

[patmo141]

Hi Jamie, thanks for the update. This is more of a curiosity and I don't think I will ever have the time/funds to build my own.

A full size PCI card?? I knew that it was a capture card in the old redcam unit and I had assumed the same for the AC until I red the "redcam bluecam comparison" chart.

http://patterson.eaglesoft.net/smilegood/cerec/3D_Infrared_Camera_vs_AC_Blue_Camera.pdf

it says that the data transfer is dependent on USB 2.0. So that must be the link between the camera itself and the PCI card? USB 2.0 has plenty of bandwidth for the 640x480 sensor in the camera, its just processing it to yield 3d which might require something faster....but sitll, its only 640x480, so I'm still thinking they have just putzed around with it a little.

2 questsions...

Any chance you could sniff out some serial numbers, product numbers etc off the PCI card so i can find out what it is/does?

Do you know how many wires are inside the camera cable? That would be a good hint. If it is 12, we (edit: I) can kind of give up. If its 4 or 6, it might be game time.

4-brown, 4 gray, 2 black, 1 yellow and 1 red would be what your are looking for.


-Patrick

 

[jamie newlands]

hi pat,

the cable has over 12 wires if memory seves me. it fits directly from the camera into the capture card which again fits into one of the pci slots.

I know I can get it to work with a redcam and my new setup will keep you posted re the bluecam

hope this helps

j

 

[patmo141]

Definitely keep me posted!

 

[juanma]

cerec 2 help!!!

Hi I know cerec 2 technology was over some years ago , bot Im form Costa Rica and I bought a Cerec 2 machine on the U.S. for putting it into a charity dental clinic in my country, im looking in this moment a dongle for this machine and a actualization software, I need help., or if some have an old cad cam system that is still working and want to sell it.

Thanks,

Dr Donato
[email protected]

 

[kamen]

Forget the USB - use the ExpressCard Slot of your laptop

Hi folks,
you can do following:
1. Get a PCI expansion chassis (i.e. Magma) ($500-$1500)
2. Connect the PCI expansion chassis to the laptop's PCMCIA/ExpressCard34/54 slot
3. Put a Cerec Frame Grabber Card ($300) into the PCI expansion chassis
4. Connect a Cerec Camera($1000) & enjoy the mobility
An extra benefit is that by putting the Cerec Frame Grabber Card into the external chassis you take the heat away from the laptop
By doing this you get a Cerec Acquisition Unit for less then $3000 + the cost of a good laptop - and you have a fully mobile setup - not the original Cerec cart
If you feel you can't do this by yourself - feel free to contact me

 

[paulg100]

id find out what the accuracy of the bluecam is before id waste your time!

they hide that information like they do with the redcam accuracy, so what does that tell you?

 

[nsitnov]

Hi folks,
you can do following:
1. Get a PCI expansion chassis (i.e. Magma) ($500-$1500)
2. Connect the PCI expansion chassis to the laptop's PCMCIA/ExpressCard34/54 slot
3. Put a Cerec Frame Grabber Card ($300) into the PCI expansion chassis
4. Connect a Cerec Camera($1000) & enjoy the mobility
An extra benefit is that by putting the Cerec Frame Grabber Card into the external chassis you take the heat away from the laptop
By doing this you get a Cerec Acquisition Unit for less then $3000 + the cost of a good laptop - and you have a fully mobile setup - not the original Cerec cart
If you feel you can't do this by yourself - feel free to contact me

Hi,
How can I contact you to discuss your solution?

Thanks

 

[chrisjgau]

**edited**

This is not the selling forum.

 

[chrisjgau]

My apologies moderator, as a newbie I didn't realise that there was a separate selling forum.

Anyone interested in a laptop scanning system can check the selling forum. This could easily be adapted for the blue cam when parts become readily (and cheaply) available. At the moment it is restricted to the red Cam

regards
chrisjgau

 

[adrenlainlv]

hi ! i am also interested in this solution - can somebody give more information ?

Is there any lack with software dongle ? 4.0.3 ?

 

[kirktab]

Has anyone considered doing this with the Omnicam yet?

 

[JMN]

I f you look close at the pci card it will have a FCC id number on it, from there you can do a fcc lookup, FCC ID Search | DriverZone , and that will tell you exactly what the card is.


Edit: or nearly any other computer or electrical device for that matter. For drivers if you don't have the cerac ones handy, you may find them here: News | DriverPacks.net

 

[silvares]

Hi,

does anyone have some pics from the inside of a cerec ac (bluecam) computer?
I am trying to build one and make it portable, but I am having troubles finding out how to connect the framegrabber to the board (msi x58 pro).

if someone could help with this it would be great.

thank you

 

[Rosario Agro]

Hi there!
You have to get one tricky chip to connect with framegrabber.