Best material for verification jig made chairside

[Kaiser7100]

I guess this thread gonna turn into something else now. I grabbed full mouth upper and lower today. Since this is first try os upper 6 implants lower 6. I went and took impressions first, very quickly with closed impression copings to make sectioned verification jig. Went to os with 6 scanbodies on lower and was epic failure with soft tissue program can’t pickup merge points. Every time you move lips checks around with the wand changing the borders and program goes crazy . It just can’t merge points on full soft tissue. I’m thinking using sticky wax to make referral points during os scan. Ran out of time today. Gonna try again next appointment. Luckily docs my friend giving patient discount to be guinea pig. Making verification jig chairside isn’t the way to go. Think key to all this is grab the scans at surgery load pmma on 4 or 6 and use pmma as long as nothing changed as the the verification jig later to set the 3d printed model. Things are moving very fast here. I’m gonna keep u guys updated. See how things turn out. I’ll post as many pics as I can. I’ve been doing implants full mouth cases 15 years. Just trying to combine technology to help save docs time and patient multiple visits. With some ideas that came to me.

 

[JMN]

I guess this thread gonna turn into something else now. I grabbed full mouth upper and lower today. Since this is first try os upper 6 implants lower 6. I went and took impressions first, very quickly with closed impression copings to make sectioned verification jig. Went to os with 6 scanbodies on lower and was epic failure with soft tissue program can’t pickup merge points. Every time you move lips checks around with the wand changing the borders and program goes crazy . It just can’t merge points on full soft tissue. I’m thinking using sticky wax to make referral points during os scan. Ran out of time today. Gonna try again next appointment. Luckily docs my friend giving patient discount to be guinea pig. Making verification jig chairside isn’t the way to go. Think key to all this is grab the scans at surgery load pmma on 4 or 6 and use pmma as long as nothing changed as the the verification jig later to set the 3d printed model. Things are moving very fast here. I’m gonna keep u guys updated. See how things turn out. I’ll post as many pics as I can. I’ve been doing implants full mouth cases 15 years. Just trying to combine technology to help save docs time and patient multiple visits. With some ideas that came to me.

Just want to make sure that when you check your verification jig, you always do one screw/implant position screwed down at a time. They can warp just enough to fool you if you screw them all down at once before checking.

 

[Kaiser7100]

Just want to make sure that when you check your verification jig, you always do one screw/implant position screwed down at a time. They can warp just enough to fool you if you screw them all down at once before checking.

Of course I only do sectioned jigs. They all go down one at a time then luted. It’s all made one piece then sectioned. After that cut remove put down one at a time and luted. Haven’t had any problems for years

 

[John in Canada]

We've been using low expansion mounting plaster for verification jigs for the last 2 years. One case the jig has broken twice, but from there we've been good. A plastic verification jig would not have picked up the discrepancy, and the Zirconia bridge would not have fit or eventually would have failed. No we just need real dimensions for the jig.....
those are coming though I am told its currently under study at the university.

 

[JMN]

We've been using low expansion mounting plaster for verification jigs for the last 2 years. One case the jig has broken twice, but from there we've been good. A plastic verification jig would not have picked up the discrepancy, and the Zirconia bridge would not have fit or eventually would have failed. No we just need real dimensions for the jig.....
those are coming though I am told its currently under study at the university.

Brand of plaster and expansion ratio please? That a very good explanation and idea.

 

[kcdt]

Brand of plaster and expansion ratio please? That a very good explanation and idea.

Pretty standard protocol for zirconia as I understand.
I run into a white mounting stone a one of our prosth's office. Sets in 5-10 minutes, zero expansion. I use it to pour a model for AO4. Whip mix, I believe...
Most mounting stone should be in that profile.

 

[John in Canada]

What is AO4? I am un aware of any gypsum based product with ZERO expansion. The lowest that I have found is .08, which is Whip Mix mounting STONE. Ratio is 26 water to 100g stone. I always measure.

 

[John in Canada]

I should state that this is not a verification jig that is made chair side or in vitro. The is a lab made, and sent to the doc after the master model is poured up.

 

[kcdt]

What is AO4? I am un aware of any gypsum based product with ZERO expansion. The lowest that I have found is .08, which is Whip Mix mounting STONE. Ratio is 26 water to 100g stone. I always measure.

AO4= all on four.. I am aware that "zero" in this scenario is " lowest" expansion for the purpose. You are correct.
Zero Is a poor term for negligible, sorry.

 

[kcdt]

I should state that this is not a verification jig that is made chair side or in vitro. The is a lab made, and sent to the doc after the master model is poured up.

Yes.
So, are you employing a traditional jig at any earlier stage? Just curious about your particular protocol

 

[JMN]

Pretty standard protocol for zirconia as I understand.
I run into a white mounting stone a one of our prosth's office. Sets in 5-10 minutes, zero expansion. I use it to pour a model for AO4. Whip mix, I believe...
Most mounting stone should be in that profile.

I'd always seen it with either l/c or a duralay type.

 

[kcdt]

I'd always seen it with either l/c or a duralay type.

Those are what we use for titanium frames.
The stone ones came about because of the brittleness of zirconia. My understanding is that the tolerance to avoid fracture is tighter than alloy or PEEK type. So you test the model with a jig of something even more fracture prone before you commit to luting abutments.
It's specific to that issue

 

[lcmlabforum]

FYI: Whip Mix has one UltiRock that is 0.07% expansion

http://whipmix.com/wp-content/uploads/WM-Gypsum-Physical-Properties_0116.pdf

LCM