Best investment for Emax

dfshorn1

dfshorn1

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Getting to the heart of the matter!

Al,
While it is all well and good telling each other which investment works and what kind of experiences have been had; I don't believe that is gives the full picture.
It is important to know the kind of pressing furnace used and whether reusable or disposable plungers are used. This represents your complete pressing system. Various types of investments and plungers absorb energy at different rates. so while persons x,y and z tell you how great they press with the same investment, you try it and you are using disposables and they are not and you have a Pro Press 100 and they have Ivoclars. It should be no surprise when your results are not theirs.
In all of my testing, I have found that changing the make of investment or type plunger can greatly impact the quality of the pressings. So what works well in one combination is crap in another. This does not include the largest variable of them all, (other than the user himself),the pressing furnace.

All that said, I still believe that the cream will still rise to the top. I have found the Ivoclar speedvest and Talladium Galaxy Universal and G2 to work best in my system.

Good Luck;
Daniel Serrago,
Ibex Dental Technologies
 
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GoldRunner

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We thought formula 1 was good until we tried Ivoclar's speed vest. Much less seating time and reaction layer. We press with an ep 500 and get excellent results.
 
Mike2

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Not sure where to put it, so here we go. Received a call that the Emax crowns for one acct. seem to fit more loose than pfm's or Emp. I. I am using the Ivoclar separator(blue rubber sep) and this particular case had very little retention to the prep. Possible causes, does anybody space all the way down to margins, or just the occl. 1/3 of the prep. Reaction layer seems very minimal and we are using the recommended ratios. I have already considered changing the spacing tech. and if that doesn't tighten things up then adj. ratio. Funny thing is his spouse has the same issues with another lab in town. Anyone have the same issue in the past????
 
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paulg100

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i dont use any spacer at all for veneers or table tops, and 2 coats of 12 micron for crowns and inlays to around 1mm from the margin.

If your finding your fits to loose then omit any spacer and/or fine tune your investment ratios for the result that you like.

Its worth remembering that to snug fits will lead to more post op sensitivity due to compression of the dentine, so slightly looser fits are not always a bad thing as long as the marginal integrity is there. If dentine bonding is being used (which ideally it should be) then its even less of an issue.
 
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SPECTRAFIRE43

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I have gone to G2 from Talladium / smooth & In My Ibex press no reaction layer.
I am pressing e.max 100 gram rings @ 50 PSI / 4 minute press time & use reccommended press temp.
Jim emmons
 
Bobby Orr ceramics

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Not sure where to put it, so here we go. Received a call that the Emax crowns for one acct. seem to fit more loose than pfm's or Emp. I. I am using the Ivoclar separator(blue rubber sep) and this particular case had very little retention to the prep. Possible causes, does anybody space all the way down to margins, or just the occl. 1/3 of the prep. Reaction layer seems very minimal and we are using the recommended ratios. I have already considered changing the spacing tech. and if that doesn't tighten things up then adj. ratio. Funny thing is his spouse has the same issues with another lab in town. Anyone have the same issue in the past????

Mike, we had a similar challenge. After, alot of backtracking of investment ratios, die spacer, etc. I determined that the assistant divesting the rings was sanding like it was an alloy...... just about sh!t my pants. Just insure the rings are being sanded carefully like the units are thin veneers coming off the refractory dies !!! I gave the assistant a tutorial on how to be gentle with proper pressure and sanding technique...... all is great now !!!

It's usually the technique(s) you least expect that are causing the headaches!!
 
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Paul Drufva

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Was going crazy using microstar! could'nt seem to get it dialed in. Tried Galaxy II. Could'nt be happier. Beautiful results, no reaction layer, super fit. Thanks Bobby Orr! I was thinking of buying an ivoclar pressing oven, no need for that now. Using Pentron Auto Press plus.
 
2th-man

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Shofu Ceravety

I've been using Shofu's Ceravety investment for casting and pressing now for about a year and like it very much. It has very little reaction layer with Emax (just sandblast off). It cost $2.00 per 100 gms.
Tim
Valley Dental Arts
 
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charles007

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I've been using Shofu's Ceravety investment for casting and pressing now for about a year and like it very much. It has very little reaction layer with Emax (just sandblast off). It cost $2.00 per 100 gms.
Tim
Valley Dental Arts

Tim, what were you using before you changed to Ceravety, and the differences in investments.

Charles
 
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charles007

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After using Microstars HS for over 1.5 years for emax, I switched back to Ivoclar's Speed Press again... Slightly tigher fits which I couldn't seem to get with HS once the warmer weather got here. . Even backed off 2 cc special liquid with no change in fits :confused: (WAS USING 15 CC SPECIAL LIQ FOR 100 GRAM. I now hate having instant setting with Speedpress..... But having very good results. I'm now mixing for 2 minutes, 10 seconds and barely have enough time to get the investment in the ring.. Had to hammer in my first batch, but got REAL LUCKY.... Mixed the full 2 min. 30 sec. I couldn't mix 2 packs for 2 rings at the same time if my life depended on it :mad:

Anyone mixing SpeedPress with shorter times than 2 min 10 sec. ? AND HAVING BUBBLE FREE SMOOTH PRESSING CONSISTENTLY?

Charles
 
Bobby Orr ceramics

Bobby Orr ceramics

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After using Microstars HS for over 1.5 years for emax, I switched back to Ivoclar's Speed Press again... Slightly tigher fits which I couldn't seem to get with HS once the warmer weather got here. . Even backed off 2 cc special liquid with no change in fits :confused: (WAS USING 15 CC SPECIAL LIQ FOR 100 GRAM. I now hate having instant setting with Speedpress..... But having very good results. I'm now mixing for 2 minutes, 10 seconds and barely have enough time to get the investment in the ring.. Had to hammer in my first batch, but got REAL LUCKY.... Mixed the full 2 min. 30 sec. I couldn't mix 2 packs for 2 rings at the same time if my life depended on it :mad:

Anyone mixing SpeedPress with shorter times than 2 min 10 sec. ? AND HAVING BUBBLE FREE SMOOTH PRESSING CONSISTENTLY?

Charles

Try the Galaxy 2 Charles......you won't be disappointed !!
 
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charles007

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Try the Galaxy 2 Charles......you won't be disappointed !!

Bob, who makes and sells Galaxy... I heard the name for years, never checked into it.
I used HS for years, for some reason I'm having tighter fits this year with my pfms, and looser fits with emax ,even when varying the ratio up and down for these materials. WEIRD.
 
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paulg100

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you keeping ur liquid and water in a fridge charles?
 
2th-man

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Charles I was using triumph from indentco. I had used it for years with my metals and starting using it with emax with ok results. Would not recommend for emax.
 
Bobby Orr ceramics

Bobby Orr ceramics

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Bob, who makes and sells Galaxy... I heard the name for years, never checked into it.
I used HS for years, for some reason I'm having tighter fits this year with my pfms, and looser fits with emax ,even when varying the ratio up and down for these materials. WEIRD.

Talladium in California
 
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paulg100

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"Nope, never have. Thought about buying a cheap wine cooler/frig to store it. "

Do it man! the heat makes a big difference to the expansion ratios, didnt take me long to notice it with the speedvest.

I only got a cheap peltier cooler so i cant set the temp but if you can, get one with a thermostat.

This will go along way to dialing in your ratios to get the exact expansion you want, and if you get a thermostat cooler then it will be consistant.

Will give you more working time as well and help to get the investment into all those little places.

Im mixing for 2 mins 30 with fridge cooled liquid/water with plenty of working time, but i think 2 rings at once might be a bit of a push, depends on how simple the petterns are.
 
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charles007

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Paul, now that I'm doing more emax, I'm convinced a wine cooler maybe a great piece of equipment to have in a lab.
It's a little stressing to pour investment out of a warm mixing bowl ! almost didn't get my cap/top ? on, on my last emax ring.
 
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