Ivoclar PrograMill7 PM7 or Roland?

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J Pierce

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I am strongly considering the PM7 at this time. I have spoken to a couple of PM7 users. There were a lot of early issues, mostly software issues that been fixed.( knock wood) All mills are running smoothly at this time. It is more expensive than most mills, but we have always had good service from Ivoclar.
 
Patrick Coon

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Hi All,

Sorry for the absence lately, been tied up a lot lately (and not in a good way ;)).

The PM7/5/3 are not limited to IV materials. They can use any 98.5mm disk out there. Blocks do require the PM mandrel, so only our materials right now (although there was an adapter for Sirona mandrels that fit the Wieland mills that should work in the PM 7 as well, if it's still available, but I can't guarantee it will work perfectly).

Milled lithium disilicate takes between 35 and 50 minutes depending on the size of the restoration.

The mill is made to switch automatically from dry to wet to dry. It still needs cleaning daily, but overnight it is able to move from dry milling to wet grinding with no problems, this is the order I recommend because of the "concrete" issues mentioned above. Then give it a quick wipe out with windex and damp rag and allow it to dry briefly before going back to dry milling. This will remove the stickiness of the lubricant from the surfaces so the zirconia dust does not stick to everything. Having said that, I have gone back and forth from wet to dry to wet with no issues, and due to the construction and shape of the milling chamber have had no issues.

lithium disilicate margins on the PM7 are very good, but of course this also is determined by the prep design as well. I don't know of a mill that will do really thin feathered or beveled margins with glass.
 
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dungtranvu

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Hi All,

Sorry for the absence lately, been tied up a lot lately (and not in a good way ;)).

The PM7/5/3 are not limited to IV materials. They can use any 98.5mm disk out there. Blocks do require the PM mandrel, so only our materials right now (although there was an adapter for Sirona mandrels that fit the Wieland mills that should work in the PM 7 as well, if it's still available, but I can't guarantee it will work perfectly).

Milled lithium disilicate takes between 35 and 50 minutes depending on the size of the restoration.

The mill is made to switch automatically from dry to wet to dry. It still needs cleaning daily, but overnight it is able to move from dry milling to wet grinding with no problems, this is the order I recommend because of the "concrete" issues mentioned above. Then give it a quick wipe out with windex and damp rag and allow it to dry briefly before going back to dry milling. This will remove the stickiness of the lubricant from the surfaces so the zirconia dust does not stick to everything. Having said that, I have gone back and forth from wet to dry to wet with no issues, and due to the construction and shape of the milling chamber have had no issues.

lithium disilicate margins on the PM7 are very good, but of course this also is determined by the prep design as well. I don't know of a mill that will do really thin feathered or beveled margins with glass.


Hi @Patrick Coon ,

I am going to buy 1 PM7 Milling machine. I staying in Vietnam. As fas as i known that PM7 is good mill for Emax CAD. Zirconia. I am wondering about Customized Abutment milliing funtion of this. Could you advise me this issue?

Thank you
 
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grantoz

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i think i would buy the sirona mill all my dentist say its fantastic and totally worth the 150 grand to save their 20 grand lab bill.
 
JeffT

JeffT

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Had a friend mill me an Amber Mill crown yesterday.
Was very nice, and the margins and fit were similar to wax.
Would these products be possible in the PM Mills?
 
Patrick Coon

Patrick Coon

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Hi @Patrick Coon ,

I am going to buy 1 PM7 Milling machine. I staying in Vietnam. As fas as i known that PM7 is good mill for Emax CAD. Zirconia. I am wondering about Customized Abutment milliing funtion of this. Could you advise me this issue?

Thank you
The PM 7/5/3 mills all have the potential to mill titanium, although we have not officially released the strategies for that yet. As for being able to mill customized abutments, again there is that potential but here in the US it would require further FDA testing and clearance. I believe in other parts of the world this is different, and would suggest contacting an Ivoclar Vivadent rep in your market to find out more on this subject.
 
Brett Hansen CDT

Brett Hansen CDT

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We bought a PM7 last December. We have had zero issues. Its a great mill and a huge upgrade for us going from the Zenotec Mini to the PM7. The support has been top notch from Ivoclar also. I milled a full arch zirconia bridge on ti bases last week. Ivoclar's tech support got on and helped me nest it properly before milling and went through my set up to ensure it would mill without issues. It was perfect. We are very happy with this purchase.
 
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dungtranvu

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The PM 7/5/3 mills all have the potential to mill titanium, although we have not officially released the strategies for that yet. As for being able to mill customized abutments, again there is that potential but here in the US it would require further FDA testing and clearance. I believe in other parts of the world this is different, and would suggest contacting an Ivoclar Vivadent rep in your market to find out more on this subject.

Thank you so much for your reply. I hope the Abutment Milling Funtion will release soon as my expectation
 
harmonylab

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some updates.

so, we had just gotten super unlucky by getting 2 faulty units at first. the 3rd one's been rock solid for us ever since. software glitched once or so, but wasn't a big deal. quite a work horse, and we do most of our milling on it. Every other mill we've had, by this time, had multiple issues with build quality, parts getting dislodged, breakdowns, etc etc. It's been phenomenal, although, this should really be the norm for any dental mills. We're very happy with it, and have bought a second PM7.
 
Affinity

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Arent we really comparing Audi to Nissan here? Sure audi has more issues with the bells and whistles, but at least it has them.

Im all for the budget workhorse, but if you can afford an RS7, why wouldnt you get one?
 
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We bought a PM7 last December. We have had zero issues. Its a great mill and a huge upgrade for us going from the Zenotec Mini to the PM7. The support has been top notch from Ivoclar also. I milled a full arch zirconia bridge on ti bases last week. Ivoclar's tech support got on and helped me nest it properly before milling and went through my set up to ensure it would mill without issues. It was perfect. We are very happy with this purchase.

Up until today have you been facing any problem with PM7? I am planing to get one for my new lab.
 
Brett Hansen CDT

Brett Hansen CDT

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We have had zero problems. Any issues I had early on were easily solved by ivoclar's tech support. Their tech support also has helped me nest and set up the milling strategy for two full arch zirconia hybrids i have milled out in our pm7. We are very happy with it.
 
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Vnix

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We have had zero problems. Any issues I had early on were easily solved by ivoclar's tech support. Their tech support also has helped me nest and set up the milling strategy for two full arch zirconia hybrids i have milled out in our pm7. We are very happy with it.

Good to hear that. PM7 is in our list to be purchased. Still can't make up the decision yet. By the way can you please pm me. Thanks
 
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Did anybody try the ICore imes350plus Pro with The loader the machine is a Beast with 2.4 kiloWatts 2400 watts Spindle torque does anybody knows the Torque on the wet or Dry
Roland DEX-52DCI dry and the Dexis-42W wet mills ?
Is there a fair comparison to the ivolar programill PM7 other than it can do both dry and wet in the same time
 
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FASTFNGR

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Hey guys... thinking of getting our first mill.

I was going to dip my toes with a Roland dry mill just for zirconia but I got introduced to the PM7 which can do dry and wet.

So the question is what do you guys think of the Ivoclar PM7?

my main concern is troubleshooting, implementation, tech supports and of course accuracy.

Thanks!
I have 2 Roland dry milling. I press e max and let some one else mill wet for me.
 
Car 54

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I have 2 Roland dry milling. I press e max and let some one else mill wet for me.

I think it was about 6 months ago? that Roland announced they had sold their 10,000th mill.
They are popular mills, for a good reason.
 
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Jussi Roivanen

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The PM7 is a very capable machine.
If I am not mistaken, it is limited to Ivoclar materials, so keep that in mind.

Milling wet and dry on the same mill can be a lot of work since you need to thoroughly clean the unit when changing milling style.

If you do a lot of units, a better option would be to get a capable dry mill for zirconia and a mill for wet. No cleaning in between and you have a backup mill in case anything happens.

I would look at the Roland and the Amann Girrbach Mikro.
PM7 is not limited to Ivoclar materials. Ivoclar materials contains a "tag" with preprogrammed material info, which PM7 "composer" can use. This enables automation (to certain extend) to make sure that machine operates as intented. To use other materials one needs to learn how to define disc heights correctly, and talk to disc manufacturers/resellers about "milling strategies" which include drill speed rpm, weather to use "wetwork", what type of drill to use etc.
 
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PM7 is not limited to Ivoclar materials. Ivoclar materials contains a "tag" with preprogrammed material info, which PM7 "composer" can use. This enables automation (to certain extend) to make sure that machine operates as intented. To use other materials one needs to learn how to define disc heights correctly, and talk to disc manufacturers/resellers about "milling strategies" which include drill speed rpm, weather to use "wetwork", what type of drill to use etc.
PM7 is open sourced to other materials. You need to contact Ivoclar for an RFID reader for whatever material you are trying to mill, and make sure the milling strategy is correct (Like said above). Last time I checked I think the external RFID reader tag was $40 dollars? I was able to not only mill Ivoclar, but I could mill Katana and other zirconias as well. I worked with a PM7 when it was first released. It's. A HELL of a mill, and I loved it. ZERO problems. I did keep it solely dry milling, Rarely did I try to run wet and dry (It does cause a lot of mess and residue and more maintenance over time, like the other person said above).

My doctor is looking to purchase Roland Mills. Do Roland mills have lots of issues? I have been trying to convince him to stay in the Ivoclar sector when it comes to mills-who can suggest otherwise, and convince me to go with him and get on the Roland side?
 
Car 54

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On average, how long will the push button type measuring key last? I'm used to the Mini touch plate and would have a back up on hand to replace when it needed it. They were pretty cheap. I suppose a back up wouldn't hurt, I just didn't know if they lasted a year or two and maybe I could wait a bit?
 
JohnWilson

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I own two they are awesome mills and I can mill anything I choose
 
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