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    LMT 2016 Fee Survey

    Discussion in 'Removable' started by Denture Dude, Oct 30, 2017.

    1. Denture Dude

      Denture Dude Member Full Member

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      Pacific region, maxillary full denture, 'total fee for this maxillary denture,',,,, $237???!!! That cant be right can it? Im pretty sure the avg was $250 15 yrs ago.
       
    2. JMN
      Curious

      JMN Christian Member Full Member

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      Rat race to the bottom.

      The trouble with averages alone is they don't give a full idea of the data. The basement 'value' labs charging $50 an arch as fast and cheap as they can go really moves the scale.

      Simply including the median figure as well would be so much more informative.

      If you're wondering:
      http://www.diffen.com/difference/Mean_vs_Median
       
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    3. Affinity
      Question

      Affinity Well-Known Member Full Member

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      What is a good price for an ivocap denture in the NW? I charge $275 but I think Im raising to $325 in 2018...
       
    4. Denture Dude

      Denture Dude Member Full Member

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      I’d like to say that an injected denture should demand a higher fee,, Not what im seeing though. Affinity, does that figure 275 include everything? Bite rims, etc?
       
    5. Affinity
      Question

      Affinity Well-Known Member Full Member

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      Yes that includes everything except teeth. I use candulor teeth and they run about $100/arch. I should clarify that I only do an average of 1-3 per month, its more special request from certain drs... Most dont need bite rims because they are immediates or Im mounting the case using their old dentures. If a case does require rims, I charge $25.
       
    6. kcdt

      kcdt Well-Known Member Full Member

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      Last lab I owned 5 years back. I was pushing 350 plus teeth.
      The fee where I'm at now is considerably more.
      We're not starving either.
       
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    7. Affinity
      Question

      Affinity Well-Known Member Full Member

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      I consider myself still 'apprenticing' at removables with the Drs direction, so I think Im in the right neighborhood. Denture setups have infinitely helped me at smile design and full mouth occlusion more than the occasional large fixed case can provide, so I feel I get a bit more out of it than the fee.
       
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    8. Denture Dude

      Denture Dude Member Full Member

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      When approached from a marketing angle, it gets very interesting. I know we shouldn't be hanging our name solely on our prices, but its still a factor that has to be considered by us techs, cuz its most certainly being considered by the docs, no matter how much they might say they love our work. Lemme ask a question to those whove been around all of this long enough to have been able to see a more clear picture of this game,,, it seems from what Ive seen over the years that the 'advertised' price for a denture includes: setup, wax up, process. Bite rim, custom tray, models, teeth, etc are added fees. Am I right in this thinking? I feel almost embarrassed that labs/techs have been squeezed so much that this subject of 'how much to charge' has to be so often discussed. Its a friggen medical device, profit shouldn't even be in question. Just some questions and opinions from a tech worried about his career future.
       
    9. rkm rdt
      Artistic

      rkm rdt Well-Known Member Donator Full Member

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      Just make sure the quality of your work makes your fees look like a bargain.
       
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    10. JMN
      Curious

      JMN Christian Member Full Member

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      How much did and does local payscale variance play into that though is my fun thought on all of this. You're not exactly in an inexpensive area now, right?

      The metrics that are collected are based on multi-state sized chunks. I see this as a useful, but error inducing, representation. A more faithful view would be gained by knowing additionally what the high/low amounts were in NYC, DC, etc, and in other sized markets. A service, product or rent and utilities in Podunk, (wait, what!?!? My spell checker didn't flag Podunk?) and LA are vastly different. This makes a fantastic difference in what price points can be offered without anyone rolling their eyes.

      I was told quite plainly by a Californian that my lab's monthly rent wouldn't even cover a day in any setting there.
       
    11. kcdt

      kcdt Well-Known Member Full Member

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      I think you're probably correct. A business plan should always be specific to that business' situation.
       
    12. kcdt

      kcdt Well-Known Member Full Member

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      Yes! I wish more people understood the value setting teeth as a skill can bring to smile design.
       
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    13. kcdt

      kcdt Well-Known Member Full Member

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      I had an overarching fee that covered all steps, but also broken down ala carte in case a clinic did some of the work themselves.
      Helps mostly with prosthodontist types.
       
    14. droberts
      Energetic

      droberts Well-Known Member Full Member

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      The issue of fees for a denture has been brought up every year due to LMT sending out a survey to
      subscribers asking for them. IMO, it does not matter what demographic area you live in. It is what you can provide to the
      client and patient of value, and service that counts.
       
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    15. XxJamesAxX
      Lurking

      XxJamesAxX Active Member Full Member

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      It may not should but it does because me in Kentucky making $100 profit on a denture is a lot different then someone in California making $100 profit on a denture. ($100 is just a random amount)

      I understand what your saying but demographic does play into the whole price cutting and race to the bottom everyone screams about IMO. It’s not always price cutting it’s just some don’t need to charge as much as others to make the same profit.

      Another example I had a tech work for me a few years back that I have since become good friends with. He came here (Kentucky) from buffalo, NY. He was making $26 an hour in NY. I hired him to help with flasking, packing, pours, and overflow of finishes. $15 an hour. He only had about 18 months experience in a lab at that time.

      After getting to know him a bit he confided that he lived in a nicer place here and lived more comfortably here at $15 then he did back in NY on $26 an hour.

      So yea it plays into what labs are going to and have to charge. Of course I learned from it and started marketing to the New York area. I play my lower cost of living to my advantage.

      One area he said that the higher cost of living/higher wages did help him out was online purchases. He would order as much as he could online because it would cost him the same online as it would cost me. So basically his money would go farther online then mine will.

      All IMO....



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    16. JMN
      Curious

      JMN Christian Member Full Member

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      Nice economics summary statement. If only the race to the bottom effect was primarily from good techs in good labs with wise location selection.
       
    17. XxJamesAxX
      Lurking

      XxJamesAxX Active Member Full Member

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      100%, McDonalds sure has done alright selling $1 cheeseburgers. I don’t eat them but I think there still doing ok without my money.

      Every business is different so why would we expect them all to charge the same? If someone can provide a product people are happy with for a lower cost does that make them bad at business or good at it?

      I know this take on it isn’t gonna be the most popular one in the room but honestly the way I look at it is price alone isn’t going to make the business successful. It may get some work in the door but eventually it will fail because even though it’s cheap everyone will realize the quality still isn’t worth the price.

      Example for me McDonald’s hamburgers I wouldn’t eat if they were free. Quality just isn’t there, but again there doing ok without me.




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    18. rkm rdt
      Artistic

      rkm rdt Well-Known Member Donator Full Member

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      China labs follow the same business plan.
       
    19. XxJamesAxX
      Lurking

      XxJamesAxX Active Member Full Member

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      Sure and some are successful in it and some are not. Not condoning it but I have bigger problems with the outsourcing to China then the price. But this isn’t the place to discuss that.

      I do think when people talk about the price cutting the person there really aggravated with is the dentist, but they feel they can’t be aggravated at them because ultimately they want there work. So they get aggravated at the lab offering the product. But both share some responsibility in that.

      Again think about McDonalds, they wouldnt be successful selling $1 burgers if people wasn’t buying them.

      As long as the dentist doesn’t see the value in a more expensive lab there gonna choose the cheaper one. Why wouldn’t they? We have to show them the value, and some just won’t ever see it.

      As long as there is demand there will always be someone trying to meet it. (Demand here is the dentist wanting cheap prices) that’s business and it’s always been that way and always will. IMO...


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    20. droberts
      Energetic

      droberts Well-Known Member Full Member

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      We as lab techs have to show and explain the value to our clients. If you cannot proceed to do so, they only
      have the means to search for what is available to them in that area. And it may be the McDonalds dollar menu.
       

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