Zirkonzahn

[ostrvo]

I would like to start with CAD / CAM. I have an excellent offer from Zirkonzahn.
Milling unit M1 with 5 axes, Scanner S600 ARTI, with Zirkonzahn CAD/CAM software.
Does anyone have this system? What are the experiences with Zirkonzahn scanner and Milling unit M1 or M5, M3 with 5 axes?

 

[BobCDT]

Closed system. You'll pay much more than need be for everything.

 

[Drizzt]

I agree with Bob . If you like to pay 200+ euros for your zirconia discs while you can have them for half the price with another system . You even pay for the ability of the scanner to generate stl files if you want to send something to be milled or sintered (custom abutments , CrCo bridges ) . Go for an open system , there are many scanners and milling machines to choose from .

 

[BobCDT]

Drizzt is also correct. Closed architecture is out of touch with today's solutions. Why would you lock yourself in when there are soooo many great open architect products available?
Not to speak badly about ZZ, their products are quite good. But, what happens when someone develops the next generation of super translucent zirconia? And, it's what dentist are asking for and ZZ doesn't have it. Your ZZ system is obsolete! You'll need to buy a new open system. Why not do it now?

 

[ostrvo]

Drizzt is also correct. Closed architecture is out of touch with today's solutions. Why would you lock yourself in when there are soooo many great open architect products available?
Not to speak badly about ZZ, their products are quite good. But, what happens when someone develops the next generation of super translucent zirconia? And, it's what dentist are asking for and ZZ doesn't have it. Your ZZ system is obsolete! You'll need to buy a new open system. Why not do it now?

Sure that in the United States you've got "soooo many great open architect products available", but the situation in Montenegro (small Balkan state) with distributors unimaginably bad. I have contacted some distributors VHF and I did not get any response for weeks. For Roland has very little support. For ZZ I got excellent support in my language (24 hours day) and distributors, and offer scanner + 5 axes mill for 28 000 euros, M1 is a model of 2013 year is not outdated

 

[BobCDT]

Try reaching out to Imes Icore. There in Germany. They manufacture seven different dental mills.

 

[ostrvo]

Try reaching out to Imes Icore. There in Germany. They manufacture seven different dental mills.

Thanks Bob, I will contact them, they have a distributor in Croatia

 

[Jass77]

I agree with Bob . If you like to pay 200+ euros for your zirconia discs while you can have them for half the price with another system . You even pay for the ability of the scanner to generate stl files if you want to send something to be milled or sintered (custom abutments , CrCo bridges ) . Go for an open system , there are many scanners and milling machines to choose from .

Hi guys

This is not completly true. ZirkonZahn modeling software generates their own output file which works with their nesting software but it also generates .stl output files. You can also import any type of .stl files generated by different scanners.
They do have something called .stl modul, but it is only used for importing .stl files directly into nesting software.
I have a M5 machine and I´m very happy with it. ZirkonZahn pucks are pricey but there are a few companies who are producing compatible size blanks, so it´s not a big isue. Personaly, I stick with Prettau, works for me.
S600 scanner is at least as good as any medium priced white light scanner on market today. It´s very solid buildt, quite heavy. Lots of different fixtures for articulators.

All in all is a nice turn key system and works very well. There are a lot of things to consider when buying a cad cam system. If you´re looking for cheapest possible way to mill zr then there are a lot of other options but on the other hand if you can profit from being associated with ZirkonZahn brand and do high end stuff for premium price then go for it. Guess it depends on your market.


Puno podrava iz Danske

Jass77

 

[primus]

Any closed system can be hacked.

Bob is just too scared to admit it. I'm sure he does it as well. (Right Bob? LOL)

Takes 1/2 a brain to do it, but usually quite easy to do.

I do it all day long. LOL Never stopped me from buying quality equipment at a decent price.

Ignore that closed stuff.

 

[Drizzt]

Sure that in the United States you've got "soooo many great open architect products available", but the situation in Montenegro (small Balkan state) with distributors unimaginably bad. I have contacted some distributors VHF and I did not get any response for weeks. For Roland has very little support. For ZZ I got excellent support in my language (24 hours day) and distributors, and offer scanner + 5 axes mill for 28 000 euros, M1 is a model of 2013 year is not outdated

What modules are included at 28.000 euros for their cad software ? Before I bought my machine , I had them submit an offer to me . With every module available , the scanner costs around 27.000 . At least this was at May 2012 .

I am from Greece , another balkan country . i beleieve the price that labs are selling zirconia is not that different . So , when I was searching for my machine , I had in mind that I have to make money out of the machine . That is why I decided against ZZ . Also I didn't like the fact tha M5 has some schick handpieces to mill . They were charging 2k for each of the extra handpieces you wanted to add .

Anyway , since you have already decided , enjoy the ride .

BTW , I have a yenadent D 40 custom made and the results I am getting is fantastic

 

[bog]

I would like to start with CAD / CAM. I have an excellent offer from Zirkonzahn.
Milling unit M1 with 5 axes, Scanner S600 ARTI, with Zirkonzahn CAD/CAM software.
Does anyone have this system? What are the experiences with Zirkonzahn scanner and Milling unit M1 or M5, M3 with 5 axes?

Zirkonzahn CAD software is in reality EXOCAD software.
They just changed the GUI (Graphic User Interface) and called it: Archiv / Modellier.
Grabbed some functionality from a BASE exocad version and made more PAID modules out of that.
So now you have the EXOCAD with a different GUI and pay much more for it plus a hefty Zirkonzahn yearly license fees
And in addition to that they milk you with high zirkonia prices.

 

[macplatao]

I was going to buy ZZ... But at the the end decided for Roland. Still like ZZ zirkonia though, so fabricated a piece that goes in the Roland (I will try to put pictures later),so I can use wathever zirconia I want, uncluding ZZ
Yes ZZ is a closed system (at the begining was not, but exocad made an update... ups!) Now is a closed system and you have to pay for the SLT feature.

PMMA and wax are also more expensive in the ZZ.

About assistance, yes they are open 24/24 but if you have a mechanical problem? You send the machine back to ZZ?

My opinion: Don´t buy closed systems!

 

[.:FIN:.]

You can also buy some of the ZZ material blanks in 98,5mm size, with the collar or without. We use Prettau with out Imes machine. Just ask from them

 

[technician]

I'm using a ZZ scanner and ZZ CAD together with Roland DWX-50 and WorkNC CAD... closed system?

 

[Drizzt]

If you have the M5 milling machine yes it is closed I think . Also you have a more expensive exocad .

 

[ZsoltM]

Zirkonzahn is not a closed system....
Also, there are many different manufacturers makes pucks fit into their mill, if you don't like theirs......however, I think prettau zirconia still one of the nicest one out there

 

[bakovic]

Sure that in the United States you've got "soooo many great open architect products available", but the situation in Montenegro (small Balkan state) with distributors unimaginably bad. I have contacted some distributors VHF and I did not get any response for weeks. For Roland has very little support. For ZZ I got excellent support in my language (24 hours day) and distributors, and offer scanner + 5 axes mill for 28 000 euros, M1 is a model of 2013 year is not outdated[/quote


hello Ostrvo did You buy Zirkonzah M1 and scanner and what was the end price of the system in Mikodental depo.
I am from Zagreb and they send offer for the scanner and M1 but it wasnt 28 000 euros,but much more..

Thank You

 

[cadfan]

ZZ was one of the first factorys that works with Frauenhofer since 2004 ill think the other factorys like AG and ZFX came later so they have different modules because the base module is not so expensive by zz (2900)Exocad 4900. Exocad is founded in 2010. If you buy a M5 3 years ago its possible to upgrade it to wet, toolchanger,and metall is anyone out doing the same in this pricerange.If you want you can mill every 98 mm blank down to 95 mm and their are a lot brands .The imes , roland , vhf what guys ever are all no technicians who knows what technicians need and thats the problem. The support and technical options depend on your distributor like cap with lots of respect but they are not marching forward most off the times one step behind. You can create STL import or export and if you are not happy with the database buy a second open one.I ts the only factory ill know that makes everything by his own starting at the scanner over coloring liquid ( which lots of the others use ) over burs to materials and microwave ofen. Internal they work with off files because they have more information and they are smoother but stl output is possible the mills are able to mill each stl but you need the stl grabber which is one part off sum thats not inlcuded in the cam because not needed working with off files thats the reason why the cam cost only 2k normaly sum 5 ax for one type of mill 9 k.maybe sometimes 6-7 K

http://www.dental-online-community.de/index.php?lang=de-de&pageID=67&angeboteID=340

in german but this guy works only short time with the M 5 before long time with the handpiece.you only have to create an account.

 

[Borivoje]

Sure that in the United States you've got "soooo many great open architect products available", but the situation in Montenegro (small Balkan state) with distributors unimaginably bad. I have contacted some distributors VHF and I did not get any response for weeks. For Roland has very little support. For ZZ I got excellent support in my language (24 hours day) and distributors, and offer scanner + 5 axes mill for 28 000 euros, M1 is a model of 2013 year is not outdated

Ja sam iz Srbije. Zelim da kupim CAD-CAM. Dobio sam mnogo skuplju ponudu za ZZ M1, te mi je prikazana ponuda vrlo interesantna. Da li ste kupili ZZ, po kojoj ceni i od kog prodavca. Mozete li mi pomoci da kontaktiram Vaseg prodavca? Unapred hvala.

 

[grantoz]

ZZ is a great mill that will keep milling even if you loose 3or4 spindles you can service it yourself most of the time and you can get after market blanks from many companies.the zz blanks are usually better quality.the system is open I export and import all the time I don't think any of the other systems dental wings 3 shape and sirona are anymore open in fact we know they are not ,they cost money to open.yes its exocad but it has been modified to do the things that zz want to do better.exocad is just the base to do things from.Ive had the m5 for almost 5 years it was the best thing I did for my lab.I have trialled other mills and I didn't buy them as they were not as good but they did run fine from my scanner and software I didn't have to buy any new software to me that's open.