Whats the best way to spend $20k toward building CAD/CAM dept

[Denko]

I am in the process of starting a new Lab and I have $20k to put towards my CAD/CAM department. I was wondering if anybody can give me suggestions. Should I focus on getting a good scanner and then send the designed units to a milling center? What scanner/software would help me the most. I have been looking at the 3shape E3 scanner. Then later I can look into buying a mill/sintering oven. Or should I get an economic scanner and finance the mill/sintering oven? I am trying to figure out what is the best way to approach building my CAD/CAM dept. Any and all help is greatly appreciated.

 

[CoolHandLuke]

put down 5k on a scanner, finance the rest. put down 15k on a mill, finance the rest.

E3 / mini

E3 / 5xs

E3 / 51d

lots of good ways to slice the pie at that point. have a look at the sponsors of the site (except sirona) and come back with a list to weight the pros and cons with us.

 

[Glenn Kennedy]

1. Get a Medit T300 or T500 scanner. Use the bundled scan software (colLab 2017) to scan cases and generate .stl files. Outsource design.
2. When you are happily scanning buy Exocad and start doing your CAD design in house. It will take time to learn Exocad. Outsource milling.
3. Pay off your scanner and Exocad or if you paid cash use the monthly profit to save for your mill.
4. Buy your mill and furnace and begin doing production in house.

If you don't know CAD/CAM it is better to learn in stages: Scan, Design, Mill. Buying everthing at one time and trying to learn all of it while under financial pressure is not pleasant. Get your scanner, learn how to use it. Then get CAD software and learn how to use it. Then get the Mill/CAM and learn how to use that.

 

[eyeloveteeth]

put down 5k on a scanner, finance the rest. put down 15k on a mill, finance the rest.

E3 / mini

E3 / 5xs

E3 / 51d

lots of good ways to slice the pie at that point. have a look at the sponsors of the site (except sirona) and come back with a list to weight the pros and cons with us.

hit right on the head. besides that get a Wacom Cintiq 22" at least we like the 27", and a CLEAN space (like a drafting table)

 

[JohnWilson]

Business plan 1st
Marketing 2nd
Develop need for scanner and purchase
Outsource your designs until you have enough volume to purchase a mill and sintering oven,

This trade is really tough today, I would probably not start a new lab today unless I had some unique business plan.

Good luck

 

[rkm rdt]

I wouldn't start a lab today.
I'd wait until Monday.
Then I'd talk to Glenn.

 

[Sevan P]

put down 5k on a scanner, finance the rest. put down 15k on a mill, finance the rest.

E3 / mini

E3 / 5xs

E3 / 51d

lots of good ways to slice the pie at that point. have a look at the sponsors of the site (except sirona) and come back with a list to weight the pros and cons with us.

One key component was left out, sintering oven. So 10k on a mill 5k on the oven.

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk

 

[sndmn2]

Just curious to your lab background. What other equipment do you already have in place?

 

[Denko]

I have 5 years total in the lab and 3 years experience scanning and setting up mill jobs. 3 shape and dwx50 mill. The main guy has 20 years experience and 15 years owning his own lab South of the boarder. We have everything for the lab except the CAD/CAM Dept. He has very little experience with cad/cam but realize it has become extremely important to stay in the business. I greatly appreciate all the advice. I am trying to be as informed as possible before pulling the trigger on such important expensive equipment. Specially since there are so many companies selling scanners and mills. I am familiar with 3 shape but haven't used exocad.

 

[sidesh0wb0b]

I have 5 years total in the lab and 3 years experience scanning and setting up mill jobs. 3 shape and dwx50 mill. The main guy has 20 years experience and 15 years owning his own lab South of the boarder. We have everything for the lab except the CAD/CAM Dept. He has very little experience with cad/cam but realize it has become extremely important to stay in the business. I greatly appreciate all the advice. I am trying to be as informed as possible before pulling the trigger on such important expensive equipment. Specially since there are so many companies selling scanners and mills. I am familiar with 3 shape but haven't used exocad.

why not hold on to that $20k for rainy day funds, and just get a scanner for the time being. plenty of reasonable options for outsourcing here on DLN or elsewhere. (id be happy to help if you need)
once youre up and cranking and have business flowing in, THEN pull the trigger on debt. or bank more cash and pay for it outright.

 

[TheLabGuy]

Everybody said it best and to sum them up...take baby steps young jedi. We know, you want it all...so did we!!! However, all these guys gave you sound advice. Start with a scanner (Argen has a good deal, can even lease/finance them, Medit/Exocad are good too, so are DOF/Exocad). Tons of options for under 20K to buy it outright out there. Not sure i'd get into milling/sintering because tons of outsourcing options, especially the sponsors on here UNTIL you have the ROI (return on investment) to cover the 50K+ for milling/sintering. Any questions, keep firing away along this journey. Most of us crusty folks wouldn't do it all over again, hence some of the negative nay sayers, but if our back was up against the wall, and heart was totally into it, we would do it all over again....because, we all started just like you!!!

 

[eyeloveteeth]

actually, @sidesh0wb0b hit it right on the head. Outsource your milling and focus on hitting enough throughput with CAD first

 

[BobCDT]

put down 5k on a scanner, finance the rest. put down 15k on a mill, finance the rest.

E3 / mini

E3 / 5xs

E3 / 51d

lots of good ways to slice the pie at that point. have a look at the sponsors of the site (except sirona) and come back with a list to weight the pros and cons with us.

If he is just starting a lab he will likely not be able to fiance anything....
Get an E1 3Shape scanner and do you'r own design work. Add a FormLabs 2 printer asap and start producing your own waxups, digital models, temps, bite splints and more.

 

[aidihra]

I'm not sure where you live, but this is what Argen is offering for the E1 scanner from 3shape in Canada. I think they have a similar deal in the US.

 

[Denko]

These suggestions really help! I have been trying to research as much as possible but the amount of information is overwhelming and difficult to sift through. The suggestions help me look at different options that I wouldn't have come up with on my own. I have some experience with CAD/CAM but only on a 3shape scanner and roland dwx50. Over the next week we will be researching the suggestions and come up with a plan of action. Thank you very much. the community support is great

why not hold on to that $20k for rainy day funds, and just get a scanner for the time being. plenty of reasonable options for outsourcing here on DLN or elsewhere. (id be happy to help if you need)
once youre up and cranking and have business flowing in, THEN pull the trigger on debt. or bank more cash and pay for it outright.

Thank you, it looks like this is a great community of support. It looks like focusing on the scanner and design and then outsourcing the milling. Today we are looking deeper into the finances to see what we can do.

I'm not sure where you live, but this is what Argen is offering for the E1 scanner from 3shape in Canada. I think they have a similar deal in the US.

Thank you! I am now waiting on a call back from Argen's sales team to see what options they offer.

 

[Car 54]

As long as you're willing and have the 10 cases a month to send to Argen, this is an excellent way to get started. And from what others here say about their
customer support and quality of milled sintered zirconia, it may be a no brainer.
Maybe also try Ivoclar to see if they have the same or matching offer, just for another opinion or option to confuse you even more

 

[PDC]

As long as you're willing and have the 10 cases a month to send to Argen, this is an excellent way to get started. And from what others here say about their
customer support and quality of milled sintered zirconia, it may be a no brainer.
Maybe also try Ivoclar to see if they have the same or matching offer, just for another opinion or option to confuse you even more

This is a great option, but what stops a doctor from purchasing this and doing just what a lab would do. It's like Argen is turning into a lab now (think GW) instead of a milling center. All the doc would have to do is have his assistants pour up the models and scan them. Then glaze when them when they get cases back...or I would imagine Argen would do that for a small charge.

 

[Car 54]

This is a great option, but what stops a doctor from purchasing this and doing just what a lab would do. It's like Argen is turning into a lab now (think GW) instead of a milling center. All the doc would have to do is have his assistants pour up the models and scan them. Then glaze when them when they get cases back...or I would imagine Argen would do that for a small charge.

Agree, unfortunately with the technology, that's what it's coming down to, isn't it, with us receiving from the
Dr's only the hardest cases they would otherwise have trouble with?

 

[PDC]

This is a great option, but what stops a doctor from purchasing this and doing just what a lab would do. It's like Argen is turning into a lab now (think GW) instead of a milling center. All the doc would have to do is have his assistants pour up the models and scan them. Then glaze when them when they get cases back...or I would imagine Argen would do that for a small charge.

And it's a lot cheaper option than buying an IOS.

 

[sndmn2]

If your going to do the Argen thing you may as well save your $200 a month and just ask a local lab to do the same thing for you. I don't know what Argen is charging but if its me I'd just hook up with someone in my area. You are getting the convenience factor through Argen.