1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

Wet Milling Green Zirconia?

Discussion in 'Dental-CAD' started by NDLMilling, Jan 24, 2012.

  1. NDLMilling

    NDLMilling Member

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2012
    Messages:
    55
    Likes Received:
    1
    It seems to me that one of the biggest killers of my tooling is chip evacuation. Air and vac don't do it. There's Always something left on the surface. I think that straight water would be a lot better.

    Does anyone have any experience/ suggestions?

    Does water change the properties of the material?


    Discuss please:D
  2. DMC
    No Mood

    DMC wheeeeeeeee!!! Donator Sponsors

    Joined:
    Sep 3, 2008
    Messages:
    6,132
    Likes Received:
    197
    It is very slooow.

    Go soak a chunk of Zirconia underwater and try to grind on it with round carbide bur.

    It is sooo much different to cut!

    I tried my best to make a milling strategy to cut wet fast, but we just bent the tools! No kidding. Totally bent the tiny 1mm tool on finishing the internal. The axial walls of crowns were too tight. Changed nothing but cut the water off....crowns fit great again. Also...we slowed down the feed to slow 250mm/min and wet-milling works, but that's just way too slow. I'd need Five-Eight mills going wet to equal a dry mill.


    I tried for quite a while! Back to regular dry milling.
    Last edited: Jan 24, 2012
  3. paulg100

    paulg100 Active Member

    Joined:
    Apr 18, 2010
    Messages:
    2,111
    Likes Received:
    6
    wet milling zirconia, at least in an inlab mcxl is horrible.

    yes its slow and the slurry that comes off clogs the filters in a heart beat, so it becomes a very hands on process.

    Start milling - Error - filters clogged - change filters - wash filters - start again. :doh:

    id dry mill over wet any day.

    good job i didnt buy it for milling zirconia.

    oh darn, its sh1t at milling glass too.. double :doh:

    im not aware of the water changing the properties though.

    just makes it a pain in the butt colouring it.
    Last edited: Jan 24, 2012
  4. Mark Jackson

    Mark Jackson New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 2, 2008
    Messages:
    1,912
    Likes Received:
    7
    As everyone else said, wet milling is terrible. Use good tools to start with. Don't shop around. Even milling wet will not do anything in terms of surface contamination. They need a very, very thorough cleaning before sintering. We do outs in an ultrasonic. Actually a series of them, and then we dry them completely before pigmenting.

    Moisture and ultrasonic cleaning will not affect quality zirconia. Cheap stuff will actually start to dissolve in an ultrasonic.
  5. NDLMilling

    NDLMilling Member

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2012
    Messages:
    55
    Likes Received:
    1
    good points:)



    Other than conserving tools, I am trying to figure out a way to run titanium in one side, and then dry mill zirconia in the other side without stopping to clean/dry the mill. I don't care about making a mess in the mill, I just need to protect the zirconia from the water/oil used during the titan milling.

    I have tried both covering the zirconia puck in wax, and packing tape without success. The material still gets saturated. I also have thought about putting the zirc in a zip lock bag, then clamping it into the machine, but the thickness of the bag wont allow it.

    Basically, I need to waterproof the puck without adding to much to it's outside dimension.


    I've thought about some sort of lacquer, or sealer, but Im afraid that it will penetrate the material to much.

    FYI. The mill is 2 sided Origin mill.




    Do you have any thoughts on that?


    popcorn
  6. DMC
    No Mood

    DMC wheeeeeeeee!!! Donator Sponsors

    Joined:
    Sep 3, 2008
    Messages:
    6,132
    Likes Received:
    197
    If you want to cut dry....it needs to be 110% DRY!

    No moisture at all, or you will have issues with chipping and tool life.

    Don't ask me how I know this. It was expensive lesson for me.

    Cut the Zirconia first dry...then on to the Ti.

    Am I a Genius, or what? LOL

    What's wrong with that? Seems obvious too me?
    Last edited: Jan 24, 2012
  7. Mark Jackson

    Mark Jackson New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 2, 2008
    Messages:
    1,912
    Likes Received:
    7
    yep.
  8. NDLMilling

    NDLMilling Member

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2012
    Messages:
    55
    Likes Received:
    1


    I thought of that...haha. BUT, there's oil in the Ti coolant, I cant imagine that doing the zirconia any good..
  9. DMC
    No Mood

    DMC wheeeeeeeee!!! Donator Sponsors

    Joined:
    Sep 3, 2008
    Messages:
    6,132
    Likes Received:
    197
    Go buy the Onion based Vegi-lube that KaVo uses.

    Bye!
  10. k2 Ceramic Studio
    Artistic

    k2 Ceramic Studio Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 13, 2009
    Messages:
    1,081
    Likes Received:
    32
    Wet milling is terrible


    KaVo Everest: Engine with 5-Axis Technology - YouTube

    Wet milling is Not terrible, :confused: it may not be every ones cup of tea but for us it works fantastically well, we use the thing all day and night, and get great results. its a bit of a sweeping statement really, it may not be able to mill a crown in 8min but it is very versatile and has given us fantastic results for over 6 years. We are only a small lab and for us precision and not speed is what we want. I was that impressed with the quality of what it produced I bought another one for my second lab. Like Scott says, use the KaVo coolant as it was designed for Ti, Zr, emax and so on and so on, or pm me and I will point you at a product just as good.

    Don't want to get anyones back up just thought it was a bit of a harsh statement. Pete
  11. Mark Jackson

    Mark Jackson New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 2, 2008
    Messages:
    1,912
    Likes Received:
    7
    Okay, it's not OUR cup of tea, how's that? I just remember all the problems we had when we had the Cerec machine in here.....

    I prefer a very efficient vacuum. It works well in all our machines.

    ai3.photobucket.com_albums_y79_Ngagi_IMG00354_20110517_0907_1.jpg
    ai3.photobucket.com_albums_y79_Ngagi_IMG00354_20110517_0907_1.jpg
  12. k2 Ceramic Studio
    Artistic

    k2 Ceramic Studio Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 13, 2009
    Messages:
    1,081
    Likes Received:
    32
    No problem, I just wanted to get the point across that not all wet mills are crap, I can understand you having a massive problem with Cerec. And I am so glad I never went down that route AS it would of put me off cad cam for ever.
    The Everest has an auto clean mode were it can clean itself at the press of a button and we only change/dryclean the filter bag every 6 months, Its just a great little system for us and thats why I was baffled by the post. Just protecting my baby sorry.:)

Share This Page