Trios to Exocad?

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sirmorty

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Giving away 40k scanners?
Yeah, Ok, I guess that make sense if you have an account that really produces and is pretty loyal. I have seen 10 year accounts leave because of a disagreement on a charge of a single remake.
But I wouldn't want to be on the hook for any of those. What if it breaks? who is responsible for the repairs/replacement? things could get ugly pretty fast.

I'm not sure how a dentist would feel being locked into a single lab for the foreseeable future. No one likes being locked into a contract.
 
CoolHandLuke

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i was recently approached to have an e4d mill placed in the lab at no cost, locked into a material contract.

where i worked previously, the parent lab bought a d810 scanner that a dollar of each unit went to paying.
 
rkm rdt

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"Or just send to a Trios ready lab.
If an exocad lab wants to receive Trios files then that lab should pay the dr's yearly license fee."

Haha, I use 3shape and even this statement makes me laugh. Look I hate being "dongled to death" as much as the next guy, and being a paid beta tester for when 3shape.
but come on man, You can't be that crazy!

It was tongue in cheek.

however I sense a tone of concern in this thread from exocad users.

They can bash 3 Shape all they want but now they risk coming across as hypocritical when they want to receive Trios files.

Luke makes a good point. No one is interested in converting files especially assistants who are the leading drivers in this technology.

I doubt many Trios docs will be eager to send to a non 3 Shape lab in my opinion.

No one has even heard on exocad around here.
 
Ken Knapp

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Or just send to a Trios ready lab.

If an exocad lab wants to receive Trios files then that lab should pay the dr's yearly license fee.

All, how many of the labs are working from dentist intraoral scans and how many are using ExoCAD?

What are the case type limitations of intraoral scans?

When are models required for intraoral scans?

What are typical remake policies for dentist intraoral scan cases?

I'm not currently working from intraoral scans but want to start.

Ken

Knapp Laboratories
 
TheLabGuy

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I'm curious Scott, what does your company charge for this "upgrade agreement" dongle license? Does that include the upgrade as well?
 
TheLabGuy

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I won't bash 3Shape users, different strokes for different folks, although I just don't agree with the yearly licensing fees is all. Personally I think it's stupid they do this and its bad business. If they need more money for R&D, then include that in the initial purchasing price. Hence why I try to avoid 3Shape at all costs!!!...or any company that attaches a yearly licensing fee on there stuff. Trios is just the fad right now, give it six months, something better will come out that will be half the price and won't have the silly yearly fees attached to it.
 
DMC

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I'm curious Scott, what does your company charge for this "upgrade agreement" dongle license? Does that include the upgrade as well?

1/2 of 3shape's yearly fees Rob.
Of course includes new builds of exocad.

Updates are improvements in exocad.
Never silly patches for bugs, unlike 3shape! LOL

What is their excuse for the many many problems and bugs when they have so many programmers on staff?

No bugs in exocad. Each version is fully tested before release.

Suck on that 3shape owners! You should be scared to update you software for a legitamite reason! YIKES!
 
TheLabGuy

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1/2 of 3shape's yearly fees Rob.
Thanks, a "upgrade agreement" sure does sound like a slick way of saying yearly licensing fee to me, not sure I'm a fan of that at all. However, at least your machine doesn't shut off if the server goes down or you don't want the upgrade!!!
 
zero_zero

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................
Trios is just the fad right now, give it six months, something better will come out that will be half the price and won't have the silly yearly fees attached to it.

My thoughts....:)
 
CoolHandLuke

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All, how many of the labs are working from dentist intraoral scans and how many are using ExoCAD?

What are the case type limitations of intraoral scans?

When are models required for intraoral scans?

What are typical remake policies for dentist intraoral scan cases?

I'm not currently working from intraoral scans but want to start.

Ken

Knapp Laboratories

1. no idea.

2. i can do all c+b, Implants, Partials, and ortho from trios scans, and some of that with iTero but not all.

3. for layered cases. most monolithics can be done sans model, but all layered cases need something to build on, extra especially if theres a porcelain margin involved.

4. this depends on two things: accurate scans free of holes, and a competent designer with consistent methodology to create consistent output. if you have this, the remakes will be down to innaccurate shading or poor prepping.

best of luck Kent! we all got your back no matter what system you go with (except sirona, we'll hang you for it)
 
CoolHandLuke

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The exocad reseller are there to do this moron. Users do not HAVE to copy paste.

Are you that dense to not understand this, and how the world works?
then why did you paste the method for non-resellers to see, moron?
 
DMC

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Thanks, a "upgrade agreement" sure does sound like a slick way of saying yearly licensing fee to me, not sure I'm a fan of that at all. However, at least your machine doesn't shut off if the server goes down or you don't want the upgrade!!!


Not sure what you are talking about.

I never used the term, "upgrade agreement". ??

Is there really something you are unclear about?

You feel some smoke and mirrors are being used to fool you somehow Rob?

What is your questions/concerns here?

exocad is very very complete as-is.

What feature do you feel you need now to make you happy with the basic C&B module anyways?
 
CoolHandLuke

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you paid a lot of money for your superior support and you give away the farm for free.

deal.

and i will post where and when i please.
 
Ken Knapp

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1. no idea.

2. i can do all c+b, Implants, Partials, and ortho from trios scans, and some of that with iTero but not all.

3. for layered cases. most monolithics can be done sans model, but all layered cases need something to build on, extra especially if theres a porcelain margin involved.

4. this depends on two things: accurate scans free of holes, and a competent designer with consistent methodology to create consistent output. if you have this, the remakes will be down to innaccurate shading or poor prepping.

best of luck Kent! we all got your back no matter what system you go with (except sirona, we'll hang you for it)

How does your remake rate of intraoral scans compare to scanning impression/model cases?

Ken
 
CoolHandLuke

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remakes from Trios, so far we have placed one trios in a doctor's office 3 months ago. 0 remakes to date out of admittedly a small 12 case sample size.

remakes of cases from the same office using traditional impressions (change is slow around here) 2 in the last 20 cases. both due to shade.

however

with the trios scanner there is no way to mark a case for a denture at all. we circumvented the system the way any sane person would. combined the power of the Lab software and the trios software, and created a simple workaround that forces the doctor to do nothing out of the ordinary, and creates no inconvenience at the lab side.

it isn't the trios that has the power, but combined with the lab software, the trios goes places iTero never dreamed nor sirona ever thought possible.
 
TheLabGuy

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Not sure what you are talking about.

I never used the term, "upgrade agreement". ??

Is there really something you are unclear about?

You feel some smoke and mirrors are being used to fool you somehow Rob?

What is your questions/concerns here?

exocad is very very complete as-is.

What feature do you feel you need now to make you happy with the basic C&B module anyways?

Maybe I'm misreading it but I got that from your post. I could be putting too much into it...feel free to inform me.

Engine build 5164
2014-02-20
General Announcements

  • Who can use this software version?
    The new version will only work with dongles for which an update agreement is present. Remember that your customers are entitled to one year of free updates starting from the first usage of the dongle. For older dongles, a new update key must be purchased in order to use the new release. If you receive the message "Sorry, the software update key is not valid", this means that the purchase of a new update contract is necessary.

Now the way I read that, is that without a update agreement (or yearly licensing fee) you can't update your machine? T or F? Then lets say you purchase the update agreement, then you have to purchase the actual update for whatever module you want? No? If you have to renew/purchase a update agreement ever year, that seems like a fancy way of saying yearly renewal to me, no?
 
DMC

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Maybe I'm misreading it but I got that from your post. I could be putting too much into it...feel free to inform me.

Engine build 5164
2014-02-20
General Announcements

  • Who can use this software version?
    The new version will only work with dongles for which an update agreement is present. Remember that your customers are entitled to one year of free updates starting from the first usage of the dongle. For older dongles, a new update key must be purchased in order to use the new release. If you receive the message "Sorry, the software update key is not valid", this means that the purchase of a new update contract is necessary.

Now the way I read that, is that without a update agreement (or yearly licensing fee) you can't update your machine? T or F? Then lets say you purchase the update agreement, then you have to purchase the actual update for whatever module you want? No? If you have to renew/purchase a update agreement ever year, that seems like a fancy way of saying yearly renewal to me, no?

Rob, those are not my works. That was written by Germans. OK?

Do you really not understand the license deal?

Buy a Dongle....get One year updates at any time.

Even Four years later...you can use any build date from the time you plug in the Dongle to the following year.

Maybe people have all sort of versions of exocad on their PC released during that time frame.
 
rkm rdt

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You're misreading it.
There's no licensing fee just an upgrade agreement purchase required ;)
 
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Hi,

First of all, let me clarify the "update contract required" situation:

If you want updates, you can buy them.

If you don't want updates, your existing exocad version will continue to work.
You just won't be able to use newer versions that came out after the update contract expired. I think that's really much different from forcing update fees upon users, no matter if they want the updates or not.

Some of our users like to stick with what they're used to, even if they're missing great new featuers. So, when it comes to exocad updates, there's no free lunch, but there's no need to pay for lunch if you're not hungry either.

Second, let me comment about the instructions *** posted (or rather, "leaked"): These OEM configuration instructions are targeted at the IT professionals at the system integrators who pre-configure the exocad release, before rolling it out to their end users.

If the system integrator choses to enable the TRIOS import feature, then their customers will have a "TRIOS import" button which they can click - it's absolutely novice-friendly. However, some exocad resellers may chose not to enable this feature.

One further important comment:
The forum user exocad-usa is not affiliated with exocad in any way; quite obviously, his writing style (laughing about IT novices, etc) is not in line with our company ethics either.
I would appreciate if you'd change your user name.

All the best,
Tillmann
CEO, exocad GmbH
 
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