THANKS HENRY SCHIEN

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paulg100

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Glidewell has been financing IOS for years. The Toothshaper mill is sweet. I'm getting one.

im guessing that things turning out better fits than what the cerec units were?

emax out of our MCXL is complete garbage, spend more time seating and patching up margins than any time saved.
 
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YMS96

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What in-house milling system and scanner is Schein selling?
 
ParkwayDental

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The E4D's are pieces of crap man! They are worthless!
 
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2thmakr

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My understanding is that it had a hard time making it out of development. Not a good sign.
 
ParkwayDental

ParkwayDental

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We had a E4D at the old lab I worked at and it is crap! The design aspect is horrible, and it takes about 30 minutes to mill one unit. They can have them! They will still need the lab when they realize they are pieces of shiZ!
 
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twinrivers14

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I still dont think that the chairside mill is whats gonna take over its the intraoral scanner that is. When sirona and patterson first back stab us with their chairside system we had a few guys buy them. It wasnt 6 months and most of them were back. They burn up to much chair time milling. But now they could just scan and send the file to any lab that has open arch. and in less than a week they have a finished restoration. Im sorry but my oppinion i havent seen a full contour crown that was milled pressed you name it that looks more true to life than layered crown.
 
Mark Jackson

Mark Jackson

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im guessing that things turning out better fits than what the cerec units were?

emax out of our MCXL is complete garbage, spend more time seating and patching up margins than any time saved.

The problem with milling emax at 300,000 RPM is chipping. The tooth shaper is only 150k, and will have less chance of chipping ceramic materials, though resins will not chip even at 300k
 
RileyS

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The problem with milling emax at 300,000 RPM is chipping. The tooth shaper is only 150k, and will have less chance of chipping ceramic materials, though resins will not chip even at 300k
if so, why won't sirona fix that problem? seems like they could do it in one of their patch updates
 
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paulg100

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the MCXL runs at 60,000rpm as far as im aware.
 
eyeloveteeth

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The issue isn't the RPM - it's the bur size.

Sirona is well aware of this issue - but they've put their investment in software first. I am not even sure they will consider an updated milling unit (unless there is a true benefit).
 
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YMS96

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What is the tooth shaper??? Bruxzir mill? I heard a rumor Glidewell is dumping those original mills for something else...
 
Mark Jackson

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The issue isn't the RPM - it's the bur size.

Sirona is well aware of this issue - but they've put their investment in software first. I am not even sure they will consider an updated milling unit (unless there is a true benefit).

Actually, I was TOLD that it is a factor or combination of factors including spindle speeds that are way too fast, harmonics caused by multiple cutting heads, tool size, shape and wear, engine speed fluctuations, collet wear, etc...

Again, resins will solve a lot of these problems. Lowering spindle speeds are not an option from what I was told, as they optimized everything for speed in chairside restorations.
 
RileyS

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Actually, I was TOLD that it is a factor or combination of factors including spindle speeds that are way too fast, harmonics caused by multiple cutting heads, tool size, shape and wear, engine speed fluctuations, collet wear, etc...

Again, resins will solve a lot of these problems. Lowering spindle speeds are not an option from what I was told, as they optimized everything for speed in chairside restorations.
WOW! They need an award for best engineered mill, best smoke and mirrors and bait and switch marketing, and best ability to blame their customers for bad results.
Poop in a bag is a fitting award. Any better ideas?
 
Mark Jackson

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WOW! They need an award for best engineered mill, best smoke and mirrors and bait and switch marketing, and best ability to blame their customers for bad results.
Poop in a bag is a fitting award. Any better ideas?

Actually, grinding is considered more accurate than milling, but the machine is small and not very robust. I have tried to warm up to the better aspects of the design and give them the benefit of the doubt, but I am feeling very disappointed in the way these upgrades, backorders and such have been handled.

If any other manufacturer did that, they'd be tarred and feathered. No matter how I try to get on the wagon, I can't seem to climb all the way on.
 
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paulg100

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"I have tried to warm up to the better aspects of the design and give them the benefit of the doubt, but I am feeling very disappointed in the way these upgrades, backorders and such have been handled."

after dumping 80k we couldnt have tried any harder to warm to it. but everything from the equipment, to support to the way they they dump on their users with built in obsolescence stinks. The best and
latest one is a time limit that they sneaked in on their nesting software which expired at the end of September. So no more stack milling without rolling back to old software now.

unless you upgrade to 4.0 s/w which dosent support our camera, and is limited to Sironas choice of branded and expensive ZR. Their excuse for the ZR is they feel labs are not qualified to select quality zirconia and its reflecting badly on their system. Maybe they should of thought what reflects on their system when they released the POS redcam on to the market and tried to tell everyone how great it is, when the data is appalling.

Why the hell they think they can dictate what materials fit MY clients needs, both in terms of quality AND price, i have no idea.

All were trying to do is get some kinda ROI out this junk (In an educated, professional and ethical manner!) and it feels like you go out of your way to hinder this at every chance. Sorry Sirona.. im done with ya.

Ahh, haven't vented on Sirona for a while, that fealt good.
 
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NicelyMKV

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Our problem is salesman and marketing departments are dictating it.
 
Gru

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...Again, resins will solve a lot of these problems. Lowering spindle speeds are not an option from what I was told, as they optimized everything for speed in chairside restorations.


So any idea whether we are looking at the chairside mills being able to mill layered resins as early as Chicago this winter?
I keep hearing that major suppliers will be introducing them this winter.
 
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