Peek

TheLabGuy

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So no one is seeing implant failure from zirk full cases and it stays pretty for ever sounds reall bad to me .A product that performs over many years without problems gee who would want that?

Come on man...I was actually agreeing with you about being cautious but seriously, did you just put zirconium hybrids and 'without problems' in the same sentence. You know what, never mind, I'm getting to old for this shlt!!!

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2thm8kr

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Come on man...I was actually agreeing with you about being cautious but seriously, did you just put zirconium hybrids and 'without problems' in the same sentence. You know what, never mind, I'm getting to old for this shlt!!!

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I've seen metal frames break in nearly the same place.
 
2thm8kr

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bond_vilains_spy_who_loved_me_richard_kiel_1600x900.jpg

The original grill.
 
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all restos will give problems with poor design and im not excluding myself.this is why caution is must. I have sinned myself. the zirc bridge you showed looks like a procera restoration I was talking about prettau restos sorry for not making that clear.As said in the the last post or so all things can fail,? sure I made a sweeping statement but I think this brings out the passion in our job I will stand by what I said previously very few probs with zirk full contour hybrid restos. Something I will say about the broken bridge is its not a hybrid and the fitting surface is beautifully clean its one of the reasons I am a massive zirk fan.I think you would have problems with a peek bridge in those dimentions failing also this is the caution bit. Labguy don't get tired over the whole thread as I think its worthwhile keeping it going hence my big statements.We are learning a lot about new material.How are you going to restore the new bridge?.
 
Drizzt

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I am confident that it will not break like this . Also , PEEK is completely bacteria free , they don't attach on it . So , if we stick to the rules , and polish everything as we should , and design everything properly , you won't have cleaning problems .
 
rkm rdt

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Come on man...I was actually agreeing with you about being cautious but seriously, did you just put zirconium hybrids and 'without problems' in the same sentence. You know what, never mind, I'm getting to old for this shlt!!!

_DSC0007.jpg


Rob,it's too bad that beautiful porcelain wasn't just cemented onto the zir frame.:(
 
cadfan

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Come on man...I was actually agreeing with you about being cautious but seriously, did you just put zirconium hybrids and 'without problems' in the same sentence. You know what, never mind, I'm getting to old for this shlt!!!

_DSC0007.jpg

Everything could fail but my first question in this case !!! why are some interfaces clean the others not ????
 
Yourgoes

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I think you would have problems with a peek bridge in those dimentions
That's speculative. If you've seen shear and bending stress maps you'd notice that the properties of a material make a huge difference to the type, location and required force of failures. Also you're only looking at restorative failures. Implant failures happen too, longevity of the implant is highly affected by the restoration, passivity is the obvious one, but occlusion/load distribution is also important.

That being said, dealing with flexible materials for fixed restorations is not something we're accustomed to in north america. I'd be interested in seeing the type and frequency of failures that our European counterparts have experienced thus far.

Scary finding of a recent study; They looked at the distance cross-arch between the second mandibular molars at rest position, and then measured it again at full opening. Results showed the mandible flexes by more than 1mm! A full arch restoration made out of practically every material we currently use today would NEVER bend that much.

So where's all the stress going? Has it been detrimental all this time causing implant failures which we believed were idiopathic failures? Is it worse the larger the A/P spread is? Do flexible materials help?

We'll only know with comparative studies. The plural of anecdote, is not evidence. I'd like meta-study level proof, but from what I've seen thus far, it looks very promising.
 
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grantoz

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Good point yourgoes about the flexing of the mandible we have known about this for a long time now .I have worked for a prosthedontist who stress breaks all his lower full arch implant bridges just in case for this reason .Saying that if the flex of the mandible thru the bone flexing or movement thru the screws on the multi units or even the direct to fixture level is such a huge problem I think we would all be in trouble by now .I think most of this website is speculative in the sense of what your saying .After all the only way to find out how things really are in the mouth is to put the resto etc in. get the patient to use it then cut the patient up and look at it under various microscopes and record the info that's what we do with lab rats I cant see that happening.I have read many articles about this and that been problem and it hasn't worked out that way and other times a particular product or procedure is going to be great and it falls over.I think the speculative nature of the participants in the website is a very helpful tool in our decision making of what we are going to use and do .Keep it up guys.
 
DevonR

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Careful with this word 'flexible' It's not like the stuff bends as this word would insinuate. It simply absorbs some of the direct forces when the teeth meet.
 
PDC

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I will be using PEKKTON , a completely different beast compared to PEEK , and Ti bases . No torque directly to the polymer ! In any case , as you said we have completely different points of view ! Nothing bad with that if you ask me !! :)

So is the newer Pekkton material indicated for cases that may have more than 2 pontics? Interesting material but it sounds like you got to be careful with its indications as far as pontics and distal extensions.
 
TheLabGuy

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So is the newer Pekkton material indicated for cases that may have more than 2 pontics? Interesting material but it sounds like you got to be careful with its indications as far as pontics and distal extensions.
I've seen 2 Pontics clinically, and even seen two molars used off distal extensions clinically, seemed to be working fine but I would still be cautious and only go one tooth off a distal extension personally and that is what is being suggested as well.

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KTR

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A lot of folks are switching from PEEK to PEKKTON because its more user friendly. The Canadians now have it (Swiss N Metal),and its here in the USA as well (Anaxdent),should be released (FDA approved) in the next month. :)
Thanks Rob
 
Drizzt

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So is the newer Pekkton material indicated for cases that may have more than 2 pontics? Interesting material but it sounds like you got to be careful with its indications as far as pontics and distal extensions.

I don't think I have to be more careful than I am with zirconia or metal or e.max or all materials . We just have to respect the instructions and not try to be heroes .
 
Adi

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Can Pekkton be pressed in an e-max pressing furnace?
 
Mohamed S. Omar

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I have a question.. Has anyone tried to press BioHPP in an Ivoclar press oven?! .. I've been thinking about it.. The BioHPP is preheated then pressed under vacuum.. So why can't i do it in my press oven?!


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