need dry air for mill

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Ethan Thompson

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Hey, folks. I am pretty new to the industry, as well as this forum. My lab has only been milling for about 3/4 months. I operate a Weiland mini 4-axis with the advanced C.A.M. and mill software. I'm having problems keeping the air bone dry. We have had a few issues with the mill from the get go, first and foremost being it like to start beating the hell out of the measuring plate for no obvious reason. After going through almost half a dozen measuring plates since we started I am beginning to think it may not be a conductivity problem. The globe on the maintenance regulator(the black and blue piece that goes on the side of the mill) is almost always foggy, not so much that you can't see through it, but definitely wet. I have a coalescing filter just before it, but it doesn't seem to be getting all the moisture. Any recommendations as to air dryers, ideas on why the mill is chewing up measuring plates, or any other info is greatly appreciated. I'll continue poking around other threads to see if I can find solutions, thanks
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Look for used dental compressors in your area. I found a jun air on craigslist, it works great, and has a condensor on it.
 
deadhead

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try and find an air compressor with a built in condenser, or get a decent regulator to put on you air line that goes to mill to help catch some of the water. we used to have this issue with our small pancake compressor but now have an industrial size compressor with built in condenser. have been using for over a year now and are running 5 mills off this compressor and no water. dont know the exact brand. I know its not cheap but we have 5 mills to protect so it was worth the investment. Somethings are just worth it to spend the extra buck
 
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After your compressor you need a oil/water separator. Next I use a refrigerated dryer, followed by a desiccant dryer. Your goal should be a -40 dew point. With moisture in the air, your Zr dust gets very sticky. It will interfere with conductivity on your touch plate. It also causes dust to cake on your burs and will cause margin chipping.
 
Getoothachopper

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I'm running the same mill and same software . I use X2 of these daisy chained right at the compressor,,,, 'Wilkerson X03-02-000 Air Dryer' (they hold a pound of the blue dessicant in each ,,,,,,Cost around $120 each off Ebay ,,,,,,, I also have the smaller version of the Wilkerson which sits right above the mill ,more for a visual (if the dessicant is not dark blue in this one the main ones need changing asap ( I refill them once or twice a week depending how much i'm milling) . I like these because you can see the material change from blue to pink without taking them apart . I always check the main ones before milling . You should never see any moisture what so ever in that little coalescing filter that comes with the mill . If it's got that far you will be having problems down the road :( ,,,,,,,,,I take carrier bags full of the dessicant home to reactivate it in the oven , lol, my wife loves it every time I do that.:mad:
s-l225.jpg
 
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I'm running the same mill and same software . I use X2 of these daisy chained right at the compressor,,,, 'Wilkerson X03-02-000 Air Dryer' (they hold a pound of the blue dessicant in each ,,,,,,Cost around $120 each off Ebay ,,,,,,, I also have the smaller version of the Wilkerson which sits right above the mill ,more for a visual (if the dessicant is not dark blue in this one the main ones need changing asap ( I refill them once or twice a week depending how much i'm milling) . I like these because you can see the material change from blue to pink without taking them apart . I always check the main ones before milling . You should never see any moisture what so ever in that little coalescing filter that comes with the mill . If it's got that far you will be having problems down the road :( ,,,,,,,,,I take carrier bags full of the dessicant home to reactivate it in the oven , lol, my wife loves it every time I do that.:mad:
View attachment 25652
Why don't you just buy a toaster oven from goodwill and do I it in your burnout room?
 
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Ethan Thompson

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Thanks everyone for the helpful advice. We are looking into getting a bigger better compressor for the entire lab eventually, however due to us moving in the near future we have put the air on the back burner until we have moved. At the moment, though, I'm looking for an inexpensive option to get us to that point before we utterly destroy this brand new mill.

On another note, anyone running a Weiland mini with the newest Cyclon using up filters quicker than expected? I talked with Brett Hansen about a month back up at the Chicago meeting and he had mentioned checking out what we had the suction power set to, thinking it might be too high. After checking it, its at 50% and doesn't go any lower. We are on our second set of filters now and after about 2 weeks of use the indicator turns red and I have to take them out and blow them off with the air hose and I get the green indicator light coming back up that says they are ok to use. If this is just the way of things I will accept it, however, if and when our volume increases the rate at which I have to blow out the filters. And I don't want to. Haha
 
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burn out room.JPG
Why don't you just buy a toaster oven from goodwill and do I it in your burnout room?
But how do will that 'wind my wife up' ,,,,thats part of the fun , lol . ,,,,,,,,,,,, I do about ten pounds at a time in three big deep metal trays then it only takes an hour . ps - " I wish I had a burn out room" :arghh::arghh:
 
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Thanks everyone for the helpful advice. We are looking into getting a bigger better compressor for the entire lab eventually, however due to us moving in the near future we have put the air on the back burner until we have moved. At the moment, though, I'm looking for an inexpensive option to get us to that point before we utterly destroy this brand new mill.

On another note, anyone running a Weiland mini with the newest Cyclon using up filters quicker than expected? I talked with Brett Hansen about a month back up at the Chicago meeting and he had mentioned checking out what we had the suction power set to, thinking it might be too high. After checking it, its at 50% and doesn't go any lower. We are on our second set of filters now and after about 2 weeks of use the indicator turns red and I have to take them out and blow them off with the air hose and I get the green indicator light coming back up that says they are ok to use. If this is just the way of things I will accept it, however, if and when our volume increases the rate at which I have to blow out the filters. And I don't want to. Haha
Again,,,moisture. Your Zr dust is damp and plugging the filters. Get it dry and you will solve many issues.
 
Getoothachopper

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Thanks everyone for the helpful advice. We are looking into getting a bigger better compressor for the entire lab eventually, however due to us moving in the near future we have put the air on the back burner until we have moved. At the moment, though, I'm looking for an inexpensive option to get us to that point before we utterly destroy this brand new mill.

On another note, anyone running a Weiland mini with the newest Cyclon using up filters quicker than expected? I talked with Brett Hansen about a month back up at the Chicago meeting and he had mentioned checking out what we had the suction power set to, thinking it might be too high. After checking it, its at 50% and doesn't go any lower. We are on our second set of filters now and after about 2 weeks of use the indicator turns red and I have to take them out and blow them off with the air hose and I get the green indicator light coming back up that says they are ok to use. If this is just the way of things I will accept it, however, if and when our volume increases the rate at which I have to blow out the filters. And I don't want to. Haha
Wow !!!!! When the indicator goes red how much zirc dust is sitting in the pull out draw under the funnel\cyclon thingy ? I got about 4 months before the light came on & the big steel pull out draw was half filled with zirc dust (only a fraction should make it to the filters) Are you sure you have the hoses on the right way ? Now i'm only a single man lab so the mill only runs a few hours a day ,some days not at all , but what you are saying sounds crazy & those filters are damn expensive ,lol :eek:
 
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I'm running the same mill and same software . I use X2 of these daisy chained right at the compressor,,,, 'Wilkerson X03-02-000 Air Dryer' (they hold a pound of the blue dessicant in each ,,,,,,Cost around $120 each off Ebay ,,,,,,, I also have the smaller version of the Wilkerson which sits right above the mill ,more for a visual (if the dessicant is not dark blue in this one the main ones need changing asap ( I refill them once or twice a week depending how much i'm milling) . I like these because you can see the material change from blue to pink without taking them apart . I always check the main ones before milling . You should never see any moisture what so ever in that little coalescing filter that comes with the mill . If it's got that far you will be having problems down the road :( ,,,,,,,,,I take carrier bags full of the dessicant home to reactivate it in the oven , lol, my wife loves it every time I do that.:mad:
View attachment 25652
i have one of those at the compressor, and one just before the mill and anything else i want to be sure stays nice and dry all the time.... i use this style
http://www.ruralking.com/campbell-h...tid=71170304&gclid=CJKVwp6l-tICFU8bgQod9yoDIQ
 
JKraver

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If I wasn't running off a dental compressor at a dental office I would use in addition to the main desiccant, a small one at the machine. Redundancy on these things is a good thing.
 
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Ceramill framework


Poslano sa mog D6603 koristeći Tapatalk
 
Brett Hansen CDT

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Thanks everyone for the helpful advice. We are looking into getting a bigger better compressor for the entire lab eventually, however due to us moving in the near future we have put the air on the back burner until we have moved. At the moment, though, I'm looking for an inexpensive option to get us to that point before we utterly destroy this brand new mill.

On another note, anyone running a Weiland mini with the newest Cyclon using up filters quicker than expected? I talked with Brett Hansen about a month back up at the Chicago meeting and he had mentioned checking out what we had the suction power set to, thinking it might be too high. After checking it, its at 50% and doesn't go any lower. We are on our second set of filters now and after about 2 weeks of use the indicator turns red and I have to take them out and blow them off with the air hose and I get the green indicator light coming back up that says they are ok to use. If this is just the way of things I will accept it, however, if and when our volume increases the rate at which I have to blow out the filters. And I don't want to. Haha

Hey Ethan! Welcome to DLN...this is a "safe" place to ask questions. :)

In the first year of running our Mini with the Cyclon suction unit, I went through a filter every three months when the red light comes on. I have discovered recently, that you don't have to change the filter out nearly that often. I would recommend once a week, taking the filter outside and knocking the loose dust out. Do this very carfefully so you don't damage the filter. I have access to compressed air outside so I carefully blow air through the filter in the opposite direction the suction pulls to get it extra clean.
 
SmartLabJon

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We have owned a Mini for years and a Select Hybrid for 2. The new vacuum system that Ivoclar is shipping with the mills is terrible. I would much rather have a Quatro iVac that came with the mini. They are less maintenance, the filter lasts longer and is cheaper. I recommend putting a Dust Deputy on every mill vacuum you have. It is the same plastic thing that is on the filter box that came with your mill that goes before the actual vacuum. You can find it on Amazon. This has greatly extended the life of our filters and mounts on top of a 5 gallon bucket for easy emptying. Honestly, I installed a Dust Deputy in the model room, our sandblasters and all of our mills and they have worked out great!

On a related note, your red light might come on your Cyclon and it might not actually be full. If you pop the top of, just shop vac around the rubber gasket - there are a few little holes in it which lets the machine "feel" the suction. When they get clogged, it throws the red light. Of course, since you have the top off anyway you might as well shop vac the filter out as well.

We also had problems with moisture and oil in our lines. Oil was only a problem once when the head to our compressor blew up. Here is our current setup in order that provides us with consistent clean, dry air:

1.Ingersoll Rand 80gal 2 stage Air Compressor - this is also fitted with an "Auto Drain" on the bottom of that tank that blows off a small bit of air/water at a pre-determined interval (I think ours runs for 5 seconds every 5 minutes or something like that). This way, you never have to worry about draining the tank.
2. Ingersoll Rand Regrigerated Air Dryer - this is a must, I do not think any lab can operate without an air dryer, milling or not
3. DeVilbills Oil/Water separator - this has replacement filter cartridges, as well as a petcock on the bottom to drain any moisture out (I check it once per week)
4. From there the air line runs over to the mill room into a small setup that contains a micron filter and a desiccant filter. When the desiccant beads change color I change them out (probably 2x per week). You can also "cook" the moisture out of these beads and re-use them as stated above. We bought a little $20 toaster oven to do so.

When it comes to compressed air you also have to consider where your air lines running through. Are they through a basement or attic or somewhere that the temperature is different? That can also cause moisture building up in the lines. That's why its a good idea to have a filter/dryer right after your tank, and right before your mill to maximize the drying of air.

I'd also recommend when you are done for the day/week or whatever, to leave pressure in your air tank (hopefully you have a shutoff valve installed on it),this will also help the tank from collecting extra moisture overnight or over the weekend.

I hope this helps!
 
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Hey Ethan! Welcome to DLN...this is a "safe" place to ask questions. :)

In the first year of running our Mini with the Cyclon suction unit, I went through a filter every three months when the red light comes on. I have discovered recently, that you don't have to change the filter out nearly that often. I would recommend once a week, taking the filter outside and knocking the loose dust out. Do this very carfefully so you don't damage the filter. I have access to compressed air outside so I carefully blow air through the filter in the opposite direction the suction pulls to get it extra clean.

Brett, Good to see you on here!

I have been doing this from the get go. Last month, however, it got to the point where I was doing this a couple times a week. If we were milling 40 units a day, I might not think this so bad, but we don't, I might do 15-20 units a day. That might get bumped up when e.Max work load is heavy, as we mill wax patterns in addition to the zirconia.
Username made a pretty good point above, that if I don't get this moisture issue buttoned up, I'll continue having problems like this.
 

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