Milling Teeth

LuthorCorp

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Hey guys,

I am looking at perhaps trying to transition physical dentures into digital but the biggest hangup I have is the milling of teeth.

Compared to card teeth how close can I get them in terms of quality wise and durability? I am new to the shaded pucks and want to know everyone's opinion.


Thanks in advanced,
 
deadhead

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milling denture teeth can be very accurate. It all depends on material,mill, and your scans of the teeth. U can either scan the denture teeth into your system which will be time consuming since u have to make sure your scans are good, so your digital file of the teeth will be accurate. u can also find a company with a tooth library already that u can load into your software and use them. Its all up to u and what you are trying to do with the teeth(looking to just mill for dentures or looking to make a custom library in your software for future designing). We use a few different libraries from a few companies since one library usually isn't sufficient since every mouth is different. As far as durability goes, that depends on what material you are milling out of. ZR would be stronger than card denture teeth, so if milling your denture teeth in ZR you will be happy with results. The staining of the teeth unless u use pre-shaded pucks can take a minute to get used to since everyone seems to have "the best" technique so you will have to find a process that works best for you and your lab. Hope this helped and good luck
 
LuthorCorp

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milling denture teeth can be very accurate. It all depends on material,mill, and your scans of the teeth. U can either scan the denture teeth into your system which will be time consuming since u have to make sure your scans are good, so your digital file of the teeth will be accurate. u can also find a company with a tooth library already that u can load into your software and use them. Its all up to u and what you are trying to do with the teeth(looking to just mill for dentures or looking to make a custom library in your software for future designing). We use a few different libraries from a few companies since one library usually isn't sufficient since every mouth is different. As far as durability goes, that depends on what material you are milling out of. ZR would be stronger than card denture teeth, so if milling your denture teeth in ZR you will be happy with results. The staining of the teeth unless u use pre-shaded pucks can take a minute to get used to since everyone seems to have "the best" technique so you will have to find a process that works best for you and your lab. Hope this helped and good luck

What about bonding acrylic to ZR? I have heard that there is trouble getting a good bond with this.
 
JKraver

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Are you talking Zirconia denture teeth?
 
LuthorCorp

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Are you talking Zirconia denture teeth?

That's what I was thinking as far as durable replacement to denture card teeth, I was thinking about getting the libraries for the card teeth but scanning them seems tedious and if our techs want to change or manipulate the teeth they wouldn't be able too. Hence my thinking milling Zirconia teeth might be the best alternative, the only reason I haven't started testing is that a tech here told me that there was no good bonding agent to bond the Zirconia to either acrylic or printed material.
 
JMN

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What about bonding acrylic to ZR? I have heard that there is trouble getting a good bond with this.
You can always, since your milling them already, mill in mechanical retention features to the sub gingival areas.

I was unaware of that primer also, very interesting.
Could you please let us know what you think of it.
 
LuthorCorp

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You can always, since your milling them already, mill in mechanical retention features to the sub gingival areas.

I was unaware of that primer also, very interesting.
Could you please let us know what you think of it.


Yeah I think im going to start testing this out shortly and see what I can do, Ideally If i can mill in mechanical retention and this primer works having 2 steps of retention is always good.

If I am not mistaken when I design dentures in 3Shape they allow me to add mechanical retention into the subgingival area on the digital designed tooth. If that's the case, this with the primer would alleviate the issue of quality in the teeth and might actually pump out a more durable product.
 
zero_zero

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We doing it all the time, only for high end stuff tho...no one wants to pay for zirconia teeth in a regular denture.Dontknow
Never had problems with debonding, we rely on mechanical retention...have yet to try the Bredent primer.
zr_hyb03.jpg
 
JMN

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Yeah I think im going to start testing this out shortly and see what I can do, Ideally If i can mill in mechanical retention and this primer works having 2 steps of retention is always good.

If I am not mistaken when I design dentures in 3Shape they allow me to add mechanical retention into the subgingival area on the digital designed tooth. If that's the case, this with the primer would alleviate the issue of quality in the teeth and might actually pump out a more durable product.

We doing it all the time, only for high end stuff tho...no one wants to pay for zirconia teeth in a regular denture.Dontknow
Never had problems with debonding, we rely on mechanical retention...have yet to try the Bredent primer.
View attachment 26049
My chief concern with these, and with carded porc teeth even, is that if it's not bonding at the eruption point, it's a trap for bacterial growth and eventual black lines around the teeth.
 
JKraver

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I don't see this as viable unless implant retained. The weight of Zirconia is tremendous compared to acrylic teeth. Do you have the capacity for Zirconia? The black line will show eventually. I cannot imagine something that would genuinely long term bond acrylic to zirconia. Maybe Zirconia to composite to acrylic? I am no chemist though.
 
eyeloveteeth

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we havent really played with the Full denture module - what teeth setting are you picking so that it produces a library file? every option i pick makes me go back and pick a denture tooth library vs printing out of gradient PMMA (at least to test)
 
JKraver

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Personally if you already got he mill I would exhaust my options with PMMA pucks and brands before dipping my toes into zirconia.
 
Patrick Coon

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Coming to a mill near you this summer. BlueLine in a disk. Monochromatic at first, then multilayer next year.

upload_2017-5-2_11-56-42.png
upload_2017-5-2_11-58-52.png
 
LuthorCorp

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Personally if you already got he mill I would exhaust my options with PMMA pucks and brands before dipping my toes into zirconia.


Do you think milling Teeth out of PMMA will provide a reliable alternative to card teeth? I am quite new to the denture side of this so really testing the waters with just the little information I have right now.
 
eyeloveteeth

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i have no idea if it will, but Ivoclar will be promoting Telio cad for denture teeth soon.

My question is what option are you picking to allow you to design from a tooth library vs denture stock?
 
eyeloveteeth

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Coming to a mill near you this summer. BlueLine in a disk. Monochromatic at first, then multilayer next year.

View attachment 26050
View attachment 26051


mr. Coon!! could you please walk me through the protocol? I know you just had your product training dates set yesterday morning, but if you could be so kind to point me in the right direction for settings I would love to start playing around with the designs.
 
zero_zero

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My chief concern with these, and with carded porc teeth even, is that if it's not bonding at the eruption point, it's a trap for bacterial growth and eventual black lines around the teeth
A valid concern for sure, I haven't thought about it...hope I'll be retired hiding down south when it starts to happen :D
 
LuthorCorp

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i have no idea if it will, but Ivoclar will be promoting Telio cad for denture teeth soon.

My question is what option are you picking to allow you to design from a tooth library vs denture stock?

Well I haven't loaded it up in awhile to start testing again, hopefully i can start this week. But if i remember correctly I was able to select a tooth library from the smile composer and then i could shape an alter each tooth individually. I could also load up a smile and edit it for a default appearance in the smile composer area.
 

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