Abutment fun

[French Cadman]

I think ZFK is italian but machine they selling DMG Sauer 20liner is german. Beautiful machines.

Ya, ya, das ist richtig ....


http://www.zfx-dental.com/home/

 

[paulg100]

one thing ive learnt after buying the inlab system is dont try and do cad/cam on the cheap!

If you cant stretch to a quality industrial unit, dont waste your time.
(not suggesting the imes i-750 isnt)

All that happens is you end up taking a step back in quality from what you were already getting (espcially from people like nobel, straumann etc),and regret it.

This probably applies even more to milling metal.

 

[DMC]

***

you done your research, some time you need to come north and play, and bring your sum 3d

Luigi is in Boston at CAP (SUM3D Owner)....Maybe he and I should come up and play.
What'cha doing tommorow?


Frenchy....of course the imes and DMG would make a bar. Why would you even begin to think they couldn't?

I make fixtures to hold anything I want to put into a mill. It will cut whatever shape I tell it to. No? Just a matter of proper CAM and tooling and of course...the fixture.

Emuge sells a cool fixture for open CNC milling..have you seen?

 

[STJDENT]

one thing ive learnt after buying the inlab system is dont try and do cad/cam on the cheap!

If you cant stretch to a quality industrial unit, dont waste your time.
(not suggesting the imes i-750 isnt)

All that happens is you end up taking a step back in quality from what you were already getting (espcially from people like nobel, straumann etc),and regret it.

This probably applies even more to milling metal.

What about DMG´s Ultrasonic 10? Can you reach high quality like with DMG 20liner/Micron?

 

[STJDENT]

Sorry Rob not sure why I called you Rick.

Thought you were just bustin balls like Shaun was

Anyhow I am so torn on investing in a machine that I am not 100% certain will manufacture an abutment to the the same standards of the ones we are outsourcing now to nobel.

I really want to take another trip back to NJ to see if I can get a bit more info on their machines and to see if the parts I get are actually touched up by humans or if they come right off the mill and into the tube that I receive. When I went their for my Procera training their was a nice tour of the older mills and Zi production but I was not allowed in to see the new 5 axis mills in the secret room

Nobel use MIcron 400 (smaller dental version than French cadman use).They have about 20-30 such machines, and also 4 measurement machines. Humans measure also manually some things.

 

[k2 Ceramic Studio]

What about DMG´s Ultrasonic 10? Can you reach high quality like with DMG 20liner/Micron?

That is one serious bit of kit, we had them in the other weak. Would love to get it to do the big implant bars/cases but how many Techs have £200k+ to spend on a milling unit, and a second hand Evo 50 will set you back £70k. I was told the DMG U-10 spindle alone costs £30k to replace.
BUT IF YOU REALLY WANT THE BEST ON THE MARKET!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[paulg100]

buy it if you wanna blow a ton of money (at least in the UK)

Theres a reason no one in the UK has that kind of kit.. the market aint big enough to make it financially viable.

last time i spoke to Renishaw, thats the conclusion they came to anyhow.

maybe a different matter in the US.

 

[STJDENT]

That is one serious bit of kit, we had them in the other weak. Would love to get it to do the big implant bars/cases but how many Techs have £200k+ to spend on a milling unit, and a second hand Evo 50 will set you back £70k. I was told the DMG U-10 spindle alone costs £30k to replace.
BUT IF YOU REALLY WANT THE BEST ON THE MARKET!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Ultrasonic is 17000 EUR+VAT without ultrasonic 15000EUR. It is expensive parts but also maybe good and do not need to replace them. Have some feeling that cheep stuff cost more with time. (Sorry my english )
I wonder how hard is it to learn and achieve good results with that machine. Have no experience with CNC or other milling at all.

 

[STJDENT]

I´m thinking on DMG Ultrasonic 10

 

[k2 Ceramic Studio]

I´m thinking on DMG Ultrasonic 10

You are getting a good price, Like I said in the UK IT IS 170K+vat at 20% and if you want the ultrasonic add on then you need 40K more. They even have ExoCad as one of there dental milling partners for the cad side.

I know what you mean Paul it is a lot of cash, but I think if you had one of those toys you would have a very big market, We have done 9 bars this weak alone(and thats just one surgeon). This thing can do a screw retained implant bridge in 148min!

 

[Shaun Keating]

Shaun, I do about 17 abutments/month with Atlantis. Their company has been great for me and my lab...that was before Dentsply bought them. Since they took over, I have had ZERO visits from a sales rep from Atlantis. My old rep got "promoted"(that is what I was told) and my contact now is his boss. I have inquire a few times about who my new sales rep was, but have so far not gotten an answer. Their product is still great, but I am a bit worried about what will happen if I run into a problem. If it wasn't for their warranty and their support, I would look for a cheaper abutment option.

I have a meeting with some of the bigshots on Tuesday here at my lab....my second one. I'll let them know your concerns Brett, that's just not right dude. And they assured me this wouldn't be the case when this all came about. There is other options for sure....call me sometime and talk to you about it

 

[STJDENT]

Upss i forgot only one "0" in my price heheh

 

[omarbhan]

OK milling center guys at 50 to 80 abutments a week can I make that imes i-750 mill be a cost effective solution over 3rd party milling? Slap in another 100 units of FCZ?

Itching to do end of year shopping to rescue me from uncle Sam's wrath.

How about milling abutment where you have the abument end(that goes into the implant it self) and you mill the upper part your self. Then you could buy smaller milling machine.

Regards
Omar

 

[Brett Hansen CDT]

I am closing in on you John! This was a record number of custom abutments for us. These came in on 2 consecutive days.

 

[JohnWilson]

Well done!, we have been running crazy on implants, I scanned and designed 19 yesterday. The slowest part of the equation is the model dept right now.

My model guy is hating to see the UPS truck, the trolley Mr Brown uses now is quite intimidating. I on the other hand love it!

Its the bar designing and all on four cases that have me pumped! I still am drooling over the numbers that KAVO unit is producing somewhere over in Europe, I won't name names

 

[Mark Jackson]

OK milling center guys at 50 to 80 abutments a week can I make that imes i-750 mill be a cost effective solution over 3rd party milling? Slap in another 100 units of FCZ?

Itching to do end of year shopping to rescue me from uncle Sam's wrath.

One thing to be aware of, is the implant reps will suddenly find reasons to dislike you once you get a milling machine in-house.