New to GC porcelain-need help

[Kam Yu]

Hi, I've never used GC ceramic before, and I need help figuring out the powder types in reference to color. I'm interested in using the LiSi porcelain. Opacious dentin and dentin is obviously self explanatory, as is the standard enamel colors 57,58 and so. But, what are the other modifiers and intensives and stuff? I only know how to use Creation and some emax ceram, so if you can relate to Creation powders, that would be even better! Thanks in advance.

 

[2thm8kr]

GC is based on Creation porcelain it is even manufactured by Klema.
Do you have the shade tabs for the different modifiers?

GC is more chroma rich, so use the enamel modifiers to tone it down/filter the chroma.

 

[Kam Yu]

GC is based on Creation porcelain it is even manufactured by Klema.
Do you have the shade tabs for the different modifiers?

GC is more chroma rich, so use the enamel modifiers to tone it down/filter the chroma.

Thanks for the response. Yeah, I know it is similar to Creation and manufactured by Klema, but I just don't understand what EO, EOP, EI, IN, TM, TO, means (i know the definition, but, I wouldn't know what to order and what to put where).

 

[2thm8kr]

EO-15 is similar to effect 1-4 in emax. I mix it with enamel to soften it a bit.
EOP-1 and 2 same as above with a little more opal effect.
EI I don't really use these.
IN is added chroma similar to opaceous dentin or deep dentin just not necessarily shade specific.
TM Use straight or mix with enamel or use straight for incisal effects
TO somewhat like effect 1 in emax

 

[Rick Sonntag]

Hi, I've never used GC ceramic before, and I need help figuring out the powder types in reference to color. I'm interested in using the LiSi porcelain. Opacious dentin and dentin is obviously self explanatory, as is the standard enamel colors 57,58 and so. But, what are the other modifiers and intensives and stuff? I only know how to use Creation and some emax ceram, so if you can relate to Creation powders, that would be even better! Thanks in advance.

Start here, this should help until you can get the color wheel and see where each one goes best. Where you put them depends on your technique and what you're trying to accomplish.

http://www.gcamerica.com/lab/products/GC_Initial/Technique_Guide.pdf

http://www.gcamerica.com/lab/products/GC_Initial/index.php

http://www.gcamerica.com/lab/products/GC_Initial/MCrefill.pdf
You'll want the Advanced Set Shade Guide color wheel from this link, GC's part number is 877022. All modifiers and enamels have the same translucency and color for each kit.

 

[Affinity]

If you dont have shade guides make them or get some.. You will use the INside powders a lot.. If you need some cheap, i have a set for sale.

 

[howitsmade]

why did you change Creation to GC?

 

[Kam Yu]

Thanks guys. a lot of diff info from you guys and i was able to piece them together to get a good grasp on things.

 

[Kam Yu]

why did you change Creation to GC?

I didn't change. I love Creation. I wanted to try a lithium disilicate porcelain other than emax ceram.

 

[howitsmade]

I didn't change. I love Creation. I wanted to try a lithium disilicate porcelain other than emax ceram.

Do You use ZI-F or Zi-CT? I use Zi-CT and have a problem with pink porcelain. Today my zirconia structure (two combined crowns on two hybrid abutments) broke after second bake. Maybe solution is to bake a crowns and after that build gingiva with ZI-F (lower temp)?

 

[adl]

Do You use ZI-F or Zi-CT? I use Zi-CT and have a problem with pink porcelain. Today my zirconia structure (two combined crowns on two hybrid abutments) broke after second bake. Maybe solution is to bake a crowns and after that build gingiva with ZI-F (lower temp)?

That sounds like a CTE issue

 

[howitsmade]

That sounds like a CTE issue

Zirkon is Amman Girbach Ceramill Zolid.
Maybe later i will post some pictures (fracture is visible only in right angle).
I heard that Creation is tested on AG Zircon, so the CTE should be perfect matched.

 

[JMN]

Zirkon is Amman Girbach Ceramill Zolid.
Maybe later i will post some pictures (fracture is visible only in right angle).
I heard that Creation is tested on AG Zircon, so the CTE should be perfect matched.

Look at their published numbers for a good answer, rarely are they a perfect match, more of a range than a spot on number with CTE, as heating speed, cooling speed, moisture, and various combinations of them all can cause a somewhat similar appearance, and vice versa unless it's really off and you're getting cracklewear look or shell-air-substructure gapping.

 

[Kam Yu]

Do You use ZI-F or Zi-CT? I use Zi-CT and have a problem with pink porcelain. Today my zirconia structure (two combined crowns on two hybrid abutments) broke after second bake. Maybe solution is to bake a crowns and after that build gingiva with ZI-F (lower temp)?

I used zi-f until ct came out. Now i only use zi-ct. What do you mean by broke? The zr substructure or the ceramic tore? If it is the ceramic that has tears, then are you slicing between the units before baking each time? I usually start my gingiva porcelain during first bake. Not to full contour though.

 

[howitsmade]

I used zi-f until ct came out. Now i only use zi-ct. What do you mean by broke? The zr substructure or the ceramic tore? If it is the ceramic that has tears, then are you slicing between the units before baking each time? I usually start my gingiva porcelain during first bake. Not to full contour though.

Yep, zr substructure broke. And yes, i also started gingiva in first dentin program (i put thin layer of G6). After first bake nothing happened. After second bake (also on dentin 1 program),where I layered enamel, G2 and G3 substructure broke (between units and inside 21 crown). Both baked i made of standard dentin program, without extra heating time, cooling time, just standard almost 18minutes program.
My substructure has full contour lingual side (except little layer of G6) up to incisial edge.

 

[Kam Yu]

Yep, zr substructure broke. And yes, i also started gingiva in first dentin program (i put thin layer of G6). After first bake nothing happened. After second bake (also on dentin 1 program),where I layered enamel, G2 and G3 substructure broke (between units and inside 21 crown). Both baked i made of standard dentin program, without extra heating time, cooling time, just standard almost 18minutes program.
My substructure has full contour lingual side (except little layer of G6) up to incisial edge.

The zr substructure cracking shouldnt have anything to do with the layered ceramic. Well, not the root cause at least. i would look more towards the processing and handling of the frame itself. the ceramic would tear or crack before the frame in a battle of expansion/shrinkage.

 

[adl]

Yep, zr substructure broke. And yes, i also started gingiva in first dentin program (i put thin layer of G6). After first bake nothing happened. After second bake (also on dentin 1 program),where I layered enamel, G2 and G3 substructure broke (between units and inside 21 crown). Both baked i made of standard dentin program, without extra heating time, cooling time, just standard almost 18minutes program.
My substructure has full contour lingual side (except little layer of G6) up to incisial edge.

Oh wow, I thought the porcelain broke. In this case I don't think it has anything to do with CTE . It's probably handling.