3rd party abutments vs original abutments

Marcusthegladiator CDT

Marcusthegladiator CDT

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My docs torque driver strips inside the head of Atlantis screws as they are not made by BioHorizons. So were trying to get away from Atlantis.
 
AltreX

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Not.... Not all "copies" are good.... many of straumann institut implant copies are simplified or changed geometrie which most times is piece of crap and you will have problems :( I have a lot of pictures :) By the way - biohorizons produce themself so ****ty abutment that it is better to buy zimmer ones if you want long lasting singles abument restoration.
 
ParkwayDental

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AltreX I am not sure why you disagreed on my post, I am assuming you disagree with me milling my own abutments because they are altered from the original specs and are a copy? Well you using Zimmer parts on BioHorizon implants are the de thing. You choose what you think is better and go with the Zimmer right? Same scenario to me.
 
ceram1

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I think the doc is in need of a new driver tip Marcus. I've never seen that problem with Atlantis on bio.
 
Marcusthegladiator CDT

Marcusthegladiator CDT

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I think the doc is in need of a new driver tip Marcus. I've never seen that problem with Atlantis on bio.
He's got the pneumatic torque wrench and he is so particular I am sure he has tried a new bit.
Were trying out Core3d centers for our BioHorizon custom Ti abutments as they use BioHorizon manufactured parts and screws. Sent in the first case this week, well see how it looks. I have to approve the design here this afternoon. They didn't email me any screen caps but they left a message last night, so I imagine well remote connect and I can direct him what to edit on the phone. I do like Atlantis and their online editor though, its a nice touch and piece of mind when you can edit it yourself.
 
ter01475

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Any lab that is milling the interface of an abutment is violating FDA regulations...any lab using base metal abutments or crowns on titanium implants is just asking for a law suit. There have been numerous studies and papers written on the effects of the reaction of the two metals together and and the studies date all the way back to the 80's....so this is not something new. As for using Zimmer abutments on Bio Horizon implants....there is a demisional difference...don't do it...the Zimmer has a deeper penetration,so it will not seat on a Bio.
It's real simple....put on the original parts and charge a reasonable fee and you and the doctor and patient can sleep at night.
 
Smithwick0208

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Any lab that is milling the interface of an abutment is violating FDA regulations...any lab using base metal abutments or crowns on titanium implants is just asking for a law suit. There have been numerous studies and papers written on the effects of the reaction of the two metals together and and the studies date all the way back to the 80's....so this is not something new. As for using Zimmer abutments on Bio Horizon implants....there is a demisional difference...don't do it...the Zimmer has a deeper penetration,so it will not seat on a Bio.
It's real simple....put on the original parts and charge a reasonable fee and you and the doctor and patient can sleep at night.

If the lab has all the paperwork done, it's not a violation.

It would be simple, if all the doctors wanted to pay the high original manufacturer abutment prices, but they don't and won't. We've been doing in house abutments for a long time with slim to no remakes due to failure. Not all non-manufacturer abutments are bad. If the work is done properly, it doesn't make a difference.
 
Doug4DAL

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Any lab that is milling the interface of an abutment is violating FDA regulations...any lab using base metal abutments or crowns on titanium implants is just asking for a law suit. There have been numerous studies and papers written on the effects of the reaction of the two metals together and and the studies date all the way back to the 80's....so this is not something new. As for using Zimmer abutments on Bio Horizon implants....there is a demisional difference...don't do it...the Zimmer has a deeper penetration,so it will not seat on a Bio.
It's real simple....put on the original parts and charge a reasonable fee and you and the doctor and patient can sleep at night.
I think you are thinking of the reaction between nickel chrome and titanium not CrCo .
 
ter01475

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No I am talking about base metal....go to google and paste this search ... the reaction of base metal with titanium dental implants , I found 16 articles that deal with this ...in just about 10 seconds. As for labs milling the interface of abutments .....why would an implant company spend close to a million dollars per mill to machine parts when they could just do it like the labs....with inferior mills and a lack of speacilized inspection tools. I am sure that all the labs do random testing of there abutments...doing cycle tests etc. The FDA even regulates the cleaning and packaging...which I am sure the labs also follow. I am also pretty sure that these labs are not selling these abutments for a reasonable profit.....say 60%. When it costs a dollar to make an abutment....like some of the labs brag about....then the docs should be paying about $1.60 rather than the hundreds that everyone is getting for these abutments.

We make a great living working with quality dentists that want the best for their patients and are willing to pay for a quality part and product...we routinuely remake GW cases as they fail after just months in the mouth. This formula has kept us in business for the last 37 years and I think will work until I choose to call it a career.
 
lcmlabforum

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If the implant screw breaks 99% of the time it can be backed out easily. Once the torque load on the screw is lost, there is no resistance it can be backed out with the wooden handle of a cotton swab.
If the surgeon/clinician forces the screw into place and cross threads it from the beginning, it won't be covered under warranty by the implant company anyhow. Get the screw extractor and tap kit out and cross your fingers.

What you are saying happens in the best of times. Some times if there is a Morse Taper, even if you can get the screw out,
the abutment is 'cold welded' (for lack of a better word) and cannot be retrieved, and that is even with a original implant
abutment (ex like the Straumann TLI). If you did not use original abutment, and the friction fit is too tight, the implant
has to be slept or removed, someone is going to be in trouble and guess who will be sharing the blame once the attorneys'
get the records?
I have helped to remove screws so often in the clinic, sometimes it is easy, sometimes even the extractor kit cannot
remove it easily, and not without risk of accidental abrasion on the internal threads of the implant itself. Yes, there are
times it can come out just like that, with an explorer even, but a lot of times, you have to find limited opening,
bone level placement with bleeding gums, so on and so on. Not every case is going to be easy, and with our
luck, the difficult ones tend to be that difficult patient you really want it to work out smoothly . . .
And hoping the oral/dental surgeon not strip the screws at the head or the thread is relying on some other
human being other than your self . . .
As for CoChromium, Straumann would use Coron but limited to supra-structures, not direct to implant level.
FWIW, my 2 cents.
LCM
 
Tom Moore

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All the reasons above are why custom abutments should be type 2 medical devices and those making them should be registered with FDA and follow GMP's and keep good records of what they did on each case.

We are registered with FDA and our custom abutments are made using type 2 protocols with documentation.

Our new One and Done/All on Four cases come with 17 pages of documentation.
 
AltreX

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AltreX I am not sure why you disagreed on my post, I am assuming you disagree with me milling my own abutments because they are altered from the original specs and are a copy? Well you using Zimmer parts on BioHorizon implants are the de thing. You choose what you think is better and go with the Zimmer right? Same scenario to me.
Just some of "blue prints" of original implant producer connection are altered or created with a new design which does not gives every time a good or beter result, worse - mostly it is temporary solution.... screw loosens, even brakes (because some stabilysing parts are missing)
 

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