Is it time to buy a scanner, projet printer?

[Iownmyjob]

Our FCZ has a lower fee than emax or pfms but my profit magin is to the roof in comparison. Not the most esthetic but strong and when you figure out how to stain and glaze them they look just as good in the posterior as a pfm. Get the mill we have a printer and 2 mills. The printer has not been used in 2 years, it is for sale. You can mil everything you need copings, FCC, FCZ. Or for now just get the scanner and outsource the milling till you can afford a mill.

Im sending out my model for scan so I make very little on FCZ currently

 

[rkm rdt]

You can always buy a Trios and scan everything.

I'll never buy another table scanner once my D700 dies.

 

[cadfan]

The 3500 MP is strictly set up for printing the model material. The software in the printer only allows them to read the print material.

It actually has the capability to print other materials, just need a computer hacker to get in there and break the firewall down to all

all materials. That goes for all the 3500 models. All 3510's have the highest resolution available, just the firewall suppresses the

features allowed. Depends on how much money you wanna spend.

.


Where do you read that ???




https://www.3dsystems.com/sites/www.3dsystems.com/files/projet_3500_dental_us_web.pdf

 

[KentPWalton]

.


Where do you read that ???




https://www.3dsystems.com/sites/www.3dsystems.com/files/projet_3500_dental_us_web.pdf

It's not that I read that....it that I've done a lot of research and talking to re-sellers of

3D Systems and I've learned that. I researched 3D printers for 2 months solid before we

bought ours and learned a lot!

 

[CoolHandLuke]

our 3500 prints all our resin structures and not models. 18 partials at a time.

 

[cadfan]

It's not that I read that....it that I've done a lot of research and talking to re-sellers of

3D Systems and I've learned that. I researched 3D printers for 2 months solid before we

bought ours and learned a lot!

Yes thats the difference btw. info from real world by the way they have been reseller therefore in the past and for a few small mills very funny infos from the real life.

 

[eyeloveteeth]

our 3500 prints all our resin structures and not models. 18 partials at a time.

do you enjoy designing partials on 3Shape?

 

[CoolHandLuke]

it isnt me that designs partials. but we did have a day when one of our partners sent us a metric ton of partials to print. that was fun.

 

[Al.]

Do you guys think i should buy a scanner/projet? I own a full service three person lab. I work 50-70 hrs a week. We do 40-50 emax a month 15 or so FCC and 5-10 FCZ maybe 30-40pfms I've considered a scanner in the past but we are not doing enough FCZ to support it for that. Being able to use the printer to mil full contour waxups should cut down on my labor time, but im still not sure it is worth the cost.
thanks.

115 units a month is really low C&B production You said your full service maybe that's where your times going ?

 

[Doug4DAL]

Do you guys think i should buy a scanner/projet? I own a full service three person lab. I work 50-70 hrs a week. We do 40-50 emax a month 15 or so FCC and 5-10 FCZ maybe 30-40pfms I've considered a scanner in the past but we are not doing enough FCZ to support it for that. Being able to use the printer to mil full contour waxups should cut down on my labor time, but im still not sure it is worth the cost.
thanks.

I would think your volume is too low to fully use a printer. Scan and mill would be much better utilized . The versatility could be useful in expanding your business.

The value of the technology is the reduction of hand moves. Fewer hand moves more speed equals more production.

 

[Al.]

I would think your volume is too low to fully use a printer. Scan and mill would be much better utilized . The versatility could be useful in expanding your business.

The value of the technology is the reduction of hand moves. Fewer hand moves more speed equals more production.

I think his volume is way to low for anything other than a scanner and outsourcing frames only.
I wouldn't even consider a mill or printer with that low production.
Milling or printing in house wont save him any time only a different way of doing it.

Outsourcing frames with a scanner is the way to go.
IMO it is more an issue of not having a good system of production or being torn between removable and fixed.

As a comparison I am a 2 person operation My wife does model work, scheduling, shipping and billing.
I go from trimming dies to putting glazed crowns in crown boxes in case pans.
But I work by the week. Do everything in groups assembly line style but with me being the only one on the line.
im not fast but can move a lot of work that way.
110 to 120 units a month ? Don't think that's enough to justify a mill. 100 a week is a different story.

This is 100% analog

 

[Tad Philip]

Stay with 3 Shape. I have a excellent used older 2007 3 Shape with 2012 premium software and year paid dongle, calibration kit with computer. Good working scanner. If interested reach me at [email protected] We just bought a new D800

 

[Al.]

How much Tad ?

 

[Tad Philip]

Contact me at [email protected] for all info

 

[cadfan]

I think his volume is way to low for anything other than a scanner and outsourcing frames only.
I wouldn't even consider a mill or printer with that low production.
Milling or printing in house wont save him any time only a different way of doing it.

Outsourcing frames with a scanner is the way to go.
IMO it is more an issue of not having a good system of production or being torn between removable and fixed.

As a comparison I am a 2 person operation My wife does model work, scheduling, shipping and billing.
I go from trimming dies to putting glazed crowns in crown boxes in case pans.
But I work by the week. Do everything in groups assembly line style but with me being the only one on the line.
im not fast but can move a lot of work that way.
110 to 120 units a month ? Don't think that's enough to justify a mill. 100 a week is a different story.

This is 100% analog

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Only for your brain AL 100 parts a month 1o dollar only for the mill the rest for whatever you want 100 x 11 month 1100 parts x 10 dollars 11000 dollars every wax up you can double digitally and try it in with pmma so your right track before you start with ceramic , extra cost pmma 5 dollar per unit.You can change all your pfm into zirkon its much cheaper to produce zirkon than pfm they are a time eater many stupid steps inkl. the opaqer better margins with zirkon no micro porosity at the margin better light transmission and no adhesive cementation with comparable results to e -max with smaller prep limitations. Its harder to find a good mill lab because most of them work on the save side that means no risk at the margins you can mill zirkon margins at 0.1 mm and min thickness at 0.3 this works in 80 % of geometries and 0.15 is no problem in the front region 0.3 is enough . You want space between two blocked crowns either you make a 0.6 strategie or you separate it in green state try to find a mill center working this way thats hard. At least to do it this way you must be creative and take the time to understand how mills work or having a reseller thats able to translate your wishes. If you buy only a scanner an go this way ill think a real good zirkon framework is min 40 Dollar so 1100 x 40 = 44000 dollars outsourcing. So the difference 33000 Dollars for material , time whatever

 

[Al.]

On the high side of his numbers that's 115 crowns a month half PFM and half emax with some FGCs and FCZ in the mix.
That's less than 30 crowns a week. 28.75 to be exact.
IMO that's a part time job for 2 people analog or digital.

Barely enough work to get a scanner for a 3 person lab much less a mill or a printer unless the problem is the removable side is cutting in to the time. Tough to impossible for one person to try to do both and make money with out stress.

Maybe like I said before could use the scanner to out source all the frames and wax ups. Just scan and dsign. Then just stain and layer. BUT then need to be able to make the scanner payment and pay the $2000 +- outsourseing bill. But your time should be freed up.

 

[Al.]

Another Deciding factor (and its a biggie ) is $ per unit charged.

$100 X 115 = $11,500
$150 = $17,250
$200= $23,000
$250= $28,750
$300= $34,500

 

[rkm rdt]

I have found that lower anterior preps or any sharp anterior prep is a challenge for a mill due to drill compensation.
I prefer to use emax cad but for those preps I have to have them printed in wax.

At this point, it makes more sense for me to outsource than to purchase a mill or printer.

 

[sidesh0wb0b]

115 units a month is really low C&B production You said your full service maybe that's where your times going ?

agreed, Al.
im still a one man and my C&B is cresting 150 units per month. granted i would love 50-70hr work week LOL

 

[Al.]

agreed, Al.
im still a one man and my C&B is cresting 150 units per month. granted i would love 50-70hr work week LOL

Do you have a scanner?